France stops smoking, starts smelling

They said it could never happen. Unlike Americans, Britons or Italians, French smokers would rebel rather than yield to government orders to stop. But nearly six weeks into the start of the ban, they have meekly obeyed and the predicted revolt has not occurred in the bars and bistrots.

As in other places, there have been some odd consequences. One is the body odour that fills the smoke-free air in discos and crowded clubs as the night drags on. Paris clubs are struggling to find alternative scents to mask the sweaty smell that is said to be turning off customers, especially women. Managers do not want to talk about it for fear of losing trade. "We've had enough trouble with the ban on smoking. On top of that we don't want people saying that the place stinks as well," said a club manager near the Place de l'Etoile.

France being the thoughtful place that it is, the pong issue has prompted discussion not of hygiene but of the psychology of odour. Why are we repelled by bodily scent, Libération wondered the other day. It hauled in Annick Le Guerer, an anthropologist and philosopher, to explain that bad smells trigger a part of the brain that makes people think of death. She suggested taking Nietzche's positive approach to smell rather than Freud's bourgeois negative one. Nietzche apparently proclaimed that "my whole genius is in my nostrils."  Freud said that society could not function unless it ignored smells. Before anyone starts making anti-French remarks, the same smell problem caused a stir in England when they stopped smoking there.

There have been other unintended consequences of the tobacco ban. One is the expansion of heated semi-open terraces where smokng is allowed. Despite cold weather these are often more crowded than the warm bars and dining areas inside. Maybe not for long because the Brussels Commission is thinking about a Europe-wide ban on the so-called propane parasols that heat the night air. 

Owners are also reporting another trend: unscrupulous customers who use an outdoor cigarette break to abscond without paying. Some establishments watch their smoking customers carefully, insisting that they leave some possession at the table as a sign that they are coming back. Gerard, landlord of a bar on the raffish rue Oberkampf told us that he gets suspicious when he sees everyone rise from a table to go out for a smoke after the main course.

"If we see that they have taken coats and everything, we say in a nice way that they should leave something behind." At Man Ray, a hip Left Bank establishment, they reported smokers leaving with unpaid champagne bottles under ther coats.

The only hold-outs against the smoking ban are the bars-tabac  especially in rural areas. The owners say that they are facing bankruptcy and villages will be deprived of their only "places of conviviality". Last  week their protests won them an apparent concession from President Sarkozy. In his eagerness to restore favour with his voters, Sarko called the bar-tabac owners into the Elysée Palace and promised that he would make an exception to help them. They took this to mean that the cigar-smoking president is going to let their customers smoke again. We can expect an outcry from the health lobby and the rest of the catering industry if Sarko does cave in to the bars-tabacs.
=============

A housekeeping note. I apologise for the slow posting of comments, but I've been enjoying the winter sunshine in the Cévennes hills this weekend. Blissful except for being woken by chainsaws. My farmer neighbour has decided to chop down the chestnut wood opposite the house -- without telling me.   

Comments

[azloon]

so the french always stank, but cigarette smoke masked the smell?

i would think that the foul odor of smoke plus pungent body odor would just produce a much more offensive aroma.......the oder many americans associate with europeans...that and rotting, stained, crooked teeth.

caucasions and africans are cursed with offending sweat glands. wonderfully, 1.4 billion chinese can live literally on top of one another without a single suspicious sniff. now there's a challenge for stem-cell research : the odorless human.

or, perhaps more simply, convincing europeans to use deoderant.

[Daniel Strohl]

"... Libération wondered the other day. It hauled in Annick Le Guerer, an anthropologist and philosopher"

C'est beau, la culture - Nietsche, Freud! Avec Libération et le Nouvel Obs (que l'étranger nous envie, selon la formule consacrée), nous sommes vraiment gâtés...

"Before anyone starts making anti-French remarks" - LOL!

[dot king]

Great, the smoking link is back, gives me a chance to post this - forgot all about it first time around:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YpAdK0CrTY

Charles, what does your neighbour say about the chestnuts? Are they horse chestnuts? The ones around here are diseased (horse chestnuts, not the comestible variety), they get their leaves too early, before any other tree and by mid-summer they're turning brown and are bare long before Autumn.
They aren't being cut down though - at least not routinely - but people are being asked to burn the leaves as they fall to kill off the parasite that's attacking them.
For the sake of your view and your privacy, I hope he intends to replant. If the parcelle appears on the cadastral plan and (particularly) the relevé de matrice as "bois" then he might well be obliged to do so.

[They're sweet chestnuts, Dot. They were the main industry in the area until the end of the 19th century, making flour etc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chestnut
And he's not replanting. He's trying to make grazing land and there's nothing I can do apparently. CB

[Dominique]

"The only hold-outs against the smoking ban are the bars-tabac especially in rural areas"

Also the "chicha bars" (water pipes) fight for keeping their business alive.

[colin grayson]

perhaps 40 years ago I read that the consumption of toilet soap in the UK was double that of france with the same population

presuming for a moment that this is true , would this mean that the british are twice as clean ...or twice as dirty?

[Juliette]

Azloon, this comment is not the most elegant you've made.
For the small bar-tabac in rural areas: what has been noticed in other countries with somking bans in that after a while, the cafés got a new corwd, that became just as faithful as the former one. And I'm not worried that the old crowd won't come back: going to the café is one of the only ways to sociolize out there, and they won't be driking their first glass of wine in the morning under their wives' noses... They'll be back. They could smoke a cigarette at home. Smoking wasn't ever the reason they went to bars...

[isobel]

I don't know whether it's just a case of bad luck on my part, but since the smoking ban in France I've had a number of near misses , where I've been walking past a cafe just at the moment when someone has chosen to throw their cigarette butt out onto the street before heading back into the bar (they all apologised btw). Maybe the situation will improve with the warm weather and people won't be in such a hurry to get back into the warm bar.

[Terry]

"And he's not replanting. He's trying to make grazing land and there's nothing I can do apparently. CB"

Legally, you are correct that there is not much you can do about it. However, my father (also a lawyer) taught me that most of the advice I would give would not be "legal" advice. Perhaps, it's time for you to construct that rooster house on the edge of his property and stock it full of cocks (the feathered kind). A couple mornings of 4:30 am roostings may learn him how. Then, you could negotiate a trade off.

[Terry]

"Before anyone starts making anti-French remarks, the same smell problem caused a stir in England when they stopped smoking there."

Okay. So, I've always heard of this French stereotype. We did have a french camper when I was a kid who fit this stereotype. However, I noticed no such "condition" when I was in France. I have found that most generalizations have some basis in fact. Is there some difference in bathing rituals in Europe as opposed to the U.S.? Here, americans bathe once or twice a day. Is it diet? When I was in Southeast Asia, body odors were different because the diet was different.

Anyone?

[azloon]

[Azloon, this comment is not the most elegant you've made.]

Juliette, i'm not aware of ANY elegant comments i've made.

i wish you'd point it out if you notice one.

:)

p.s. do you get two dental cleanings a year under the state health care plan? it's 'just the ticket' for les taches de tabac.

p.p.s. when i sent the stunning, naked "carla" photos (Rocket's link which lasted 24 hours before CB's wife/girlfriend made him take it off) to a friend in hawaii, he emailed me back: yeah, but i'll bet she has bad breath.

[isobel]

Speaking of stereotypes Terry - it seems the UK is keen to get the kids off to an early start in their anti French attitudes. A series of children's books called "Mr Men" which features such characters as Mr Happy, Mr Greedy,etc was published in the 70s.It has just been made into a tv series by channel 5 in the UK.
The following from The Daily Telegraph 10 February 2008

"A Five spokesperson said: "Mr Men is a comedy show for four to seven-year-olds.

"The fact Mr Rude has a French accent is meant to be light-hearted and tongue-in-cheek and no offence to the French people is intended."

A spokesman for the French ambassador to the UK refused to comment but a source at the French Embassy said: "It is obviously meant in a light-hearted way but it won't improve Anglo-French relations."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/02/10/nrude110.xml

[rockinred]

Americans eh? Obsessed with eliminating the natural smell of people's bodies. There really is something dark and deep-seated about this peculiar neurosis.

[Edward Johns]

During the three and a half years that I have lived in France, I have been struck by the number of people who appear to have taken a bath in deodorant before leaving the house!
Often their wake is evident to the nose (admitting that mine is of decent size)for many metres after the aroma carrier has gone by. Does this overcompensation indicate a greater sensitivity to the body-odour issue in France or are French perfume sellers too good at their job ?

[dot king]

"And he's not replanting. He's trying to make grazing land and there's nothing I can do apparently. CB"

Terry's probably right that you can do nothing now, especially that he's started to cut the wood down. What does the farmer want to graze there? If it's cattle or horses, then he might leave a stand of trees for shade. Then again, in the Cévennes (the small part of the area I know is quite wild - like the Lake District with sun) it could be sheep.
In any case, if the parcelle is in close proximity to your home, you might be able to claim that your enjoyment will be hindered (flies, noise, smell, loss of privacy - sorry Charles, I'm trying to help really!)
Question to ask - how far from your house is this wood (exactly in metres - important), this might make a difference to what he can do. I've always understood that an owner had to apply formally to change "la designation" of any plot. Each plot has its designation on the Relevé de Matrice which you should be able to consult at the Mairie or the local tax office Service du Cadastre.
All this said, I'm sure you are a "switched on" owner, and there is of course the avoidance of becoming "le voisin chiant" to take into consideration.
Then again, a tree is a plant, and in this case a crop, that has a life limited in time and productivity and there comes a point where the wood has more value than the trees, one can hardly blame the farmer for wanting to optimise his returns.
As long as he does a proper job of clearing and grassing his land, you'll probably get used to it eventually. Shame though, and it would have been neighbourly to inform, if not consult you.

[Hope]

There was a survey about the French and their personal hygiene habits last year results here:
http://femme-au-foyer.blogspot.com/2007/04/you-dirty-frog.html

Otherwise, the smoke/sweat thing was much commented on British TV when I was at home at Xmas!

[Rich]

In the school where my wife works, many of the teachers are ignoring the smoking ban, and are continuing to smoke in the staff room...a fine example to the pupils!

[dot king]

When I first came to France as an au pair, I was surprised that my access to the bath/shower room was limited to once a week. For the rest of the time, I had a cabinet de toilette in my bedroom with a washbasin and a bidet (I didn't even know what this was for at the time). I had learned at school that personal hygiene was very important, I can remember writing in my Dom Sci exercise book "wash all corners every day". Gentle reader, I will leave you to imagine the schoolgirl jokes that evolved from that bit of learning.

Some people I've been helping with translations had bought a small house in a hamlet which they intended to do up and rent to have extra income. This quite charming stone building had a bathroom and a loo, but no septic tank. (Don't ask - I was told about a downpipe leading to an open gulley, but I didn't pursue the matter.)
Planning permission to restore was refused, as the house had no land to install a septic tank "aux normes" (you need 2500m²), and the nearby town, contrary to what the purchasers had been told, was not planning to link the hamlet to the tout à égout - it's on bedrock and they would have to dynamite half the hamlet to make the connections!
The estate agent had even told them in writing that the tout à égout was to arrive within a year, so they were able to start proceedings and were advised by the avocat that he would request a simple annulment of the sale.
At the first hearing, at the TGI (Tribunal de Grande Instance), the judgement went against them. I translated the judgement for them and was amazed to see that the grounds for dismissing the case were that the judge considered it was "quite usual" to find houses in the country without "sanitaires" and he saw no reason to think that the house was not "à usage d'habitation" just because you couldn't bathe and go to the loo in comfort.
Of course this was both hilariously funny and not at all amusing.
After consulting an Avoué, the case was taken to appeal and I happily report the sale was annuled and the people have recuperated their money and interest accrued. It took nearly 3 years.

It is true though, that you still come across houses without sanitaires here in The Sticks; I helped with a vendange one year and when i asked to use the loo, I was led into the stables and shown a pile of staw in one of the stalls. and more than one ancient fermier has said in answer to the questions "Et la salle de bains? La fosse septique?"
"Ah, ma pauvre, ici il n'y a que la Nature!"

[Louise]

Well maybe it's down to the French women not shaving their excessively hairy armpits. I'm of Chinese origin, and I'd guess that the reason I never smell and don't ever really sweat is because I don't have hair on my underarms (that plus a daily shower). I notice however that many European women - notably French and Italian, don't shave their armpits - it's quite horrible when you see the hairs poking out from sleeveless tops or vests.

[francbroc]

AZLOON: would you by any chance be a racist who thinks he smells better than anybody else on the planet? I don't know what you smell of, but it can't be intelligence...
I think your remark really stinks.

[qwerty]

Charles - Quick, find an "église classée", or something classé, near your place in the Cévennes, and go see the maire to object about the cutting down of the trees. There's a 13th century church near where I live and it wasn't even possible to chop up a tree in the garden that had already toppled over due to a storm, without a permit from the DDE which took months to obtain.
I think you have a reasonable chance. Or lobby any "vert" candidate to the municipales for his/her support.

[richard jones]

Quand, moi, j'habitais la France c'était toujours les Belges qui puaient.

[azloon]

[AZLOON: would you by any chance be a racist who thinks he smells better than anybody else on the planet? I don't know what you smell of, but it can't be intelligence...
I think your remark really stinks.] Francbroc

if you'd been around here for awhile, you'd know i am an 'equal opportunity' critical observer. it just so happens this blog is about france, so guess what?

do i think that all french reek of body odor, and have rotten, crooked, yellow-stained teeth?

do i think that all americans are neurotic 'clean freaks' with smile fetishes?

do i think that all russians are vodka-swilling depressives?

do i think that all irish are sentimental, blarney-spouting pub-crawlers?

just enough of each of them to make some fun out of it.

you comment presumes that intelligence has a smell. that would clearly tilt the intelligence balance towards europe and away from north america.

have you considered that perhaps intelligence is odorless?

[Daniel Strohl]

Azloon,

Allow me an odorless and fully off-topic remark : this morning, on TV, I heard Mr. Obama say the following :

"I will change the country, I will change the world !"

Not even our much criticized Sarkozy dares to say that he wants to change the world. Ok, may be it would be easier for 300 millions Americans than for 64 millions French to (try to) change the world. Nevertheless, one should not forget that there are also 1300 millions Chinese and may be 900 millions Indians who may have also opinions on how to change the world ...

[Daisy]

Sarko did say he and Tony Blair were going to conquer the world, but said nothing (that I can recall) of saving it.

[richard jones]

Soixante-quatre million de français. Je ne crois pas!

http://globalis.gvu.unu.edu/indicator_detail.cfm?country=FR&indicatorid=132

[Daniel Strohl]

Correction to my post dated 11 FEB 2008 15:08

I am not quite sure, but Obama probably said "we will change the country, we will change the world" - but in any case, I felt that he implied to say "I will".

[Gill]

On a smoking issue, not linked to personal odour, as a non-smoker I was pleased with the introduction of the smoking ban both in the UK and France. However, the french application of the law has actually deprived me of one of my great pleasures in France of "people watching". I am much more comfortable in restaurants now where my food is no longer tainted by cigarette smoke but in bars I now find myself confined to the interior to avoid the smoke. Previously I could sit with my coffee (or whatever) in the warmth and dry of the external covered areas and watch life go by at leisure and could cope with the occasional smoker nearby but now that all smokers congregate in these areas the atmosphere is worse than ever. Roll on the summer when the outside tables are set up! As you may guess my visits to France (about 12 days per month) are all in the north - Normandie - where the weather is not conducive to sitting completely outside at the moment

[Daniel Strohl]

Richard Jones,

"Soixante-quatre million de français. Je ne crois pas!"

Richard, I heard the following figures several times a few weeks ago on French TV and radio:
- over 63 millions in France métropolitaine (I forgot the exact figure)
- overall (including the départements d'Outre Mer, i.e Guadeloupe, Martinique, Guyane, La Réunion and may be Mayotte) : over 64 millions.

I was also surprised when I heard these figures. If they are true, it means that the "allocations familiales" and emigration work!

Daisy,

I was not aware of Sarkozy saying that he was going to conquer the world with Tony Blair! May be we should ask Mme Royal to save it (the world) in 2012 !

[azloon]

Daniel --

americans tend to become megalomaniacal from time to time. please forgive us our grandiosity.

we like the idea of changing the world. it's fun. like how we turned iraq into a democracy in two weeks.
that was fun, really it was. changing the world makes us feel all 'warm and fuzzy' about ourselves. don't you like to feel 'warm and fuzzy' about yourself? sure you do!

we think we'll introduce freedom of expression and religion into china in time for the olympics. that should be fun. and exciting. and maybe even a little bit dangerous. hehe.....

see link below with over three million hits:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjXyqcx-mYY

here are the same entertainers' spoof of the john mccain message:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gwqEneBKUs

you get the idea. we say 'yes, we can' and .... poof.....a changed world.

so get ready, it ought to be an exciting ride.

(we call this 'government by youtube,' otherwise known as 'viral politics.'

[Rocket]

I personally haven't found the French to be any more smelly than other nationalities except for one sales girl that I had many years ago. She smelled like consommé soup.

But then again. I haven't been up and close to a French person for years. Even when I was up close, I don't remember being turned off by any particular body odor.

But I did work in the French branch of a German cosmetics company (schwarzkopf)for over 10 years and they had all the statistics which in fact said that the French used much less personal hygiene products than many other countries in Europe. (toothpaste, shampoo, soap)

here is a link

http://www.embarrassingproblems.co.uk/sweating_a.htm

Watch out for processed foods. they are the killer especially ham. Viva espana!

Coffee doesn't help either.

Now if you'll excuse me I have to bathe as my last shower was before the New year. I'll think about brushing my teeth next month.

[Maggie G]

I find it hard to believe these statistics showing the French use so much less soap, shampoo and toothpaste than everyone else.

Maybe they brush their teeth less because they never eat between meals.

And maybe they buy that giant savon de marseilles, which makes it look like they use less soap.

I personally haven't noticed any dirtiness or smelliness among the French, and I think those old clichés from the second world war should be dumped once and for all.

I would say, though, that the French don't seem to be very good at washing their hands after going to the toilet. In restaurants I have even seen members of staff go straight out without washing their hands, and I do find this pretty shocking. But I am sure that there are many others who do wash thier hands.

[Mary Chin]

Here in Quebec, a smoking ban went into effect last year, banning all smoking in all public places. But I didn't see any stories about a sudden awareness of body odor.

[Valentin]

"In restaurants I have even seen members of staff go straight out without washing their hands"

Yup. Same in banks, unfortunately - at least those I've worked in.

[Rocket]

Mary

"Here in Quebec, a smoking ban went into effect last year, banning all smoking in all public places. But I didn't see any stories about a sudden awareness of body odor."

You would be amazed at the ability to link subjects in France. If this keeps up we may have a passionate debate on the death penalty stemming from the smoking ban.

[John Gregory Flinn]

"..., they have meekly obeyed and the predicted revolt has not occurred in the bars and bistrots"

Well our local patron, Pepe never ceases to complain as do all his smoking customers.
Now, he hardly has enough customers to notice body-odour!
The problem of absconding is very real as I commented in January.

There are mutterings of rebellion against, both Sarkozy and the EU, accompanied by such comments as 'Le Pen would never have done this'!
The easy passage through parliament of the Lisbon 'stitch up' is also included in the same cough - sorry breath!

[Brett]

Charles, My sympathies for the loss of the chestnut wood. Perhaps the grazing land will introduce some new floral beauty (along with the new herbivorous neighbors)!

[Liz]

Maybe the French do not wash their hands after using the toilet-that goes for most men around the world:). However, one thing I have noticed since moving to France is that the French wash their hands before a meal, whether it's at a restaurant, snacks at a bar or at home. All our French friends who've spent the night, brush their teeth before they go to bed as well. And I haven't seen any French women with hairy arm pits - that's a German thing.

[Gill]

I have seen many french women with hairy armpits (and hairy legs) but that doesn't mean they smell. I agree that it is rare to see a french woman wash her hands after using the toilet but here in the UK they don't do it properly. Most women turn the tap on and rub thir fingers under the water for a few seconds and they think that is OK. Most of them probably do it only for show.

[John Styx]

The main consequence of the smoking ban for me (I stopped smoking some years ago) is the apparition of ugly heaps of cigarette ends in front of cafés. Some bars bought industrial-grade ashtrays, but most smokers just throw their cigarette ends in the streetwalk. It's truly disgusting.

Regarding handwashing: lot of companies in France are now offering antibacterial soap and handwashing guidelines ("wash your hand for 30 seconds at least under hot water" and so on). In my company we also have electronic (?) faucets which don't require physical contact to operate and stickers explaining to people why they should cover their mouth while coughing or sneezing. It's all part of a campaign to reduce epidemical risks (avian flu, normal flu, gastric flu and so on).

[Olly]

I am surprised with the number of people who waste their time wathing whether others wash their hands after toilet or not! That IS an obsession, isn't it? And every obsession is based on self-conscience. I don't care about other people's hygiene until they actually smell by my side.

[Romain]

This thread is probably the most racist I've seen in a while.

It would fit perfectly chez fuckfrance.com where the French are considered sub-humans. And I'm sure it will be posted there to the glee of many.

Replace the French, with the Jews stink, the mexicans stink, the blacks stink, the arabs stink and see how racist that is.

The "French stink" meme is a well known tool of every French-hater on the planet.
Charles Bremmer should know better. And he does know better. He knowingly uses this disgusting ethnic slur to pander to his anti-French readers.
I hope you won't be invited any time soon on French televison to give your "opinion" on French politics. You're no better than Ann Coulter or Dieudonné.
Actually, we at miquelon.org are going to email radio stations and TV channels in France with your latest anti-French pique and ask them to boycott you.

Beyond the obvious racism in using that cliche, let’s address the facts, at least when it comes to France:

According to this report, in Europe, the French are:
http://www.infores.com/public/uk/newsevents/thoughtleadership/uk_new_073103.pdf

""First in shampoo consumption (see page 18)
First in deodorant consumption (see p 19)
Third in toothpaste consumption (see p 20)
Second in laundry detergent consumption (see p 11)

Here is how the report concludes: “In France, coffee and biscuit consumption is above average but it is in the bathroom where the French really splash out. They spend the most on deodorant and shampoo and are just behind Germany in terms of bath and shower product spend”""

Facts don't lie.

[dot king]

Romain: the title of the artice is "France stops smoking, starts smelling" - it depends which way you read it. Those who have smoked know that they get an enhanced sense of smell when they give up. They are able to notice odours that they didn't notice before. That's quite widely accepted I think and one way of reading the title.
If Charles has written an article about it, then it's because the problem has been highlighted elsewhere in the French news/press.
You can also read it to say that since they stopped smoking, the French have started to smell.
It's a headline, it's supposed to be snappy, thought-provoking, wanting you to read on (it worked, you did).

I've just scan-read the comments and I couldn't spot "the French stink" anywhere and I'd say that at least half of the comments are in open support of or positive about the French.
It's obvious that in any place where people are expending energy, they perspire more, and armpit-smells will dominate where cigarette-smoke did before. It's mentioned above that other countries which have banned smoking have experienced the same phenomenon.
This thread is quite well-balanced IMO. If there was racism it would have been picked up by more than one of us by now. Many of us have chosen to live in France. Speaking for myself, if it smelled too bad, I'd have gone somewhere else.
Could I suggest you target the French bashers only and leave everyone else alone?

ps - you have now alerted any French-bashers who might have been "just passing" to the website fuckfrance.com - I'd never have dreamed such a thing existed. You can pat yourself on the back for that one. well done.

[rocket]

Romain

"This thread is probably the most racist I've seen in a while."

Well Romain, This blog practices what we call free speech so you are welcome with your comments.

"Actually, we at miquelon.org are going to email radio stations and TV channels in France with your latest anti-French pique and ask them to boycott you."

Rather hypocritical but not at all surprising that you and your hypersensitive friends over at the hypersensitive miquelon.org who spend hours scouring the internet for any comment that you interpret to contain one iota of what you consider to be French bashing would employ the same methods of boycott that you so disdain and denounce with undiluted scorn when it comes from your nemeses and a boycott is directed against the French.

Why don't you guys do another 6 month collection to raise a couple hundred dollars so you can by a handful of books to educate Charles and then sail over here to France in a raft and present him with it, much in the same way you tried and failed to do with Jay Leno.

(A few years ago at Miquelon, it took them about 6 months to get contributions to buy a handful of educating Jay books on France. Then once they got the money from contributions they drove to California to try to present the books to Leno, thinking they were going to get on the Tonight Show. ROTFL. Once they got to the studio someone told them to leave the books at the reception and get out. Not even free tickets to the show!

Now if you want to get deeper into the subject, have at it.

[qwerty]

My friends don't smell. I've usually worked in Paris lawfirms where people don't smell - lawyers tend to wash. I was seconded for a while to a big US industrial company in France, where a few people DID smell: mainly engineers. On the first reasonably hot day in spring people take off their jackets in the metro and it's as if they had't taken a bath all winter. Parking lots tend to stink, except the expensive Vinci ones, at the Rond-Point and elsewhere.

It's a catégorie socio-professionnelle thing. I guess it's the same everywhere. When my father comes across a smelly person in a supermarket, he discreetly drops a deodorant in his/her caddy. Just a hint.

[qwerty]

My goodness, in my last post I realise I've omitted to mention probably the smelliest segment of the population, worldwide: librarians!

Isn't that a disgustingly racist remark? But then what about blond jokes, aren't those racist as well?

[millier marc]

what do you think about this site

f...france.com

[Since you ask, Marc, I find it brainless, racist, ignorant, unfunny and nasty. And I won't print the full name on The Times' site]

[Valentin]

LOL this is too funny, well I have to agree with QWERTY: I'm working in a bank and you can tell on which floor you are only by taking a good deep breath after landing from the lift. I can assure you there's a huge difference between the technical teams floor, the financial support teams one, and the management one ! :))

[millier marc]

thank you very much Charles. its my opinion too.

thank you , really.