France readies for the Sarko showdown

We have been treated to an odd coincidence of imagery over the past couple of days. They invoke the futile but inevitable clashes of great armies. One is the Armistice Day remembrance of World War One, over which Nicolas Sarkozy has just presided. The other arises from the battle, opening tomorrow night, between Sarko's troops and the forces of resistance to his campaign of reform on multiple fronts. Here's the story from today's paper.

Without overdoing the parallel, the showdown feels just as inevitable as that of August 1914. Sarko is propelled by the big part of France that voted for his promise last spring to end the archaic labour practises and corporatism that drag on the economy. Dug in across no-man's land are the railway and other state sector workers and leftwing students who believe they have common cause. Their aim is to halt the Sarko-revolution.

"This is our chance to stop the Sarkozy government", an excited student leader presumptiously said on the radio this morning. Just before her, we heard an SNCF (railway) employee, say: "I don't see why I shouldn't be able to retire at 55. I will fight to keep the right. Everyone should be able to retire at 55."

Those two quotes will have been cheered by die-hard leftists, but they could not have been better designed to serve the Sarko cause.

There is not a great deal of support left for the old selfish attitude. There is a consensus among all main parties and even some of the unions that the so-called special regime workers have "eaten their white bread" and must now say adieu to their privileges and accept the generous reitrement terms of the rest of the state's work force.

As for the students, their grievance is political. They do not like a reform which allows the country's delapidated universities to govern themselves if they choose. One Orwellian slogan from the protestors is "All universities must be equal." Even Ségolène Royal, the Socialist who was defeated by Sarko,  suggested today that the students should cool it and face real problems such as how to tackle the 40 percent first year drop-out rate at French colleges.

Like wars, French strikes often get out of hand, taking on an unstoppable momentum. That happened in 1995 after Jacques Chirac's first government tried to reform the railway pensions and was then defeated by the street. Chirac took fright and went to sleep in the Elysée Palace for a decade. This time, Sarko has chosen to make a stand on the special regimes because he knows that times have changed and they no longer enjoy popular support.

"I will hold firm, not because I am stubborn, but because it is in France's interest," he told his troops on Friday. "I was elected to do difficult things and I will do them".

Sarkozy is nevertheless taking a risk, reforming on all fronts at once and allowing resistance to "coagulate" against him, as le Monde put it. We are seeing the emergence of Sarko tactics. He talks tough and then gives ground while François Fillon, his Prime Minister, plays bad cop. We saw it when Sarko flew to striking fishermen in Brittany last week and handed them a 30 million euro subsidy to go back to work. Fillon is sounding defiant on this week's strikes, saying the Government would not cave in like so many of its predecessors. "In the past, they put forward reforms...and then gave ground after conflict so only the illusion of reform was left. We don't want that any more," he said yesterday.

Sarkozy relies on his own considerable skills as a trouble-shooter, so we can expect him dropping in on railway depots to face the angry men, as he did after their last strike (picture at top). If he can hold his own, it looks good on the evening news. It would probably have helped his case with them had he not accepted a 172 pay rise for himself 10 days ago.

The view in the political and business world is that Sarkozy will win. "If he gives in, he becomes 'Chiracised'," Eric Boucher, a le Monde commentator, wrote. "The break with the past will not have lasted and Nicolas Sarkozy will only have been a paper tiger. So there is little risk, however long the strikes last, that the president will give up his plans."

Comments

[Frank Schnittger]

A good general always chooses his battle grounds carefully, fights on his own terms, and minimises the risk of distractions which can blunt the force of his main focus of attack.

Sarko should choose one or two battle grounds where he knows he can win, thus creating a momentum and a sense of inevitability that he will win the greater battles ahead.

Above all, he should divide and conquer, and prevent the emergence of a wide coalition of forces against him. If this means giving ground on some fronts so that he can secure his major objectives, so be it.

The danger, it seems to this distant observer (sorry Ms. Marple et al, I'm neither British nor French) is that Sarkozy has stirred up a hornets nest and made this a battle of honour amongst a very wide cross section of the public service.

If the whole state transport infrastructure is paralysed, it will not be long before there will be rumblings even from his most fervent supporters that he has "mismanaged" the situation.

The problem with Sarko's leadership style is that it is very personalised and egotistical, which provides the enemy with a very visible hate figure and target. The more effective change managers usually go about the work quietly, surreptitiously, and dramatic changes have been accomplished even before many people realise they were contemplated.

Sarko needs to have some surprise reinforcements in reserve, pretend to fight on bogus fronts, whilst making sure the real change happens elsewhere.

Perhaps, like Napoleon’s Generals, he just needs to be lucky. But as Arnold Palmer, the great golfing pro once said, “the more I plan and practice, the luckier I get!”

PS Charles, most of the comments on "How Sarko did in America" seem to have disappeared. Is this a technical hitch or did you delete them in absolute frustration with your recalcitrant bunch of bloggers?

[Blendi Progri]

It is a real showdown, it cant be postponed anylonger.

This test will show what Sarko is made from... although a slight concern remains - if he wins - will anyone/ anything in France stop Sarko The Monarko?

[Albert]

Please forgive me for going off-topic for a second… When I posted the comment about the nature of the contributions (9 November), I hadn't meant to open such a can of worms. I feel I should clarify. Charles Bremner's posts provide a fascinating insight into contemporary France, which is the reason we read the blog (it would be great if they could be published in book form); the feedback is secondary, and of course needn't be read at all. However... When I first found this blog I expected the theme to be France seen through British eyes. In the same sense, if I went to Le Monde and found that their London correspondent had a blog, I'd quite naturally expect the main topic to be Britain seen through French eyes. With this Times blog it takes a while to adjust to the fact that the dominant theme (of the feedback) is Franco-American rivalry, as if the blog was owned by the NY Times. I wonder whether some people post here because there isn't a NY Times alternative. As for encouraging more French contributors, perhaps it could be made clear that posting in French is ok.

Back on topic. I have to say that living in a country (England) where there is a very clearly understood league table of universities, with most places in the top institutions reserved for the most expensively educated, I quite like the phrase ‘All universities must be equal’. It is a good aspiration.

[John Gregory Flinn]

Today's leader 'The Thatcher Moment' was remarkably upbeat and to the point.
Did you write it Charles?

Lets hope the price of Oil has peaked for the moment, which should take some of the "heat" out of the fishing, farming and hauliers' causes for protest.
Perhaps giving ground in Brittany was calculated bearing in mind the windfall-taxes that a rising Oil price has brought the French government.

The students' protests seem patchy, my daughter at Béthune reports nothing is happening - its probably all those non-numerate types making 2+2=5 again.....!
They may be expecting another victory over Fillon, but second time round is never the same (as Arthur Scargill knows to his chagrin)!

One of Sarko's problem will be his own behavior this very week with the fishermen : he said "yes" to them and justified it with very weird and dangerous words : he said that France had to protect his fishermens because their problem with oil price was indeed an "identity" problem. Meaning, "we can't ask them to do anything else than fishing".

I am afraid, he did point on something very true eventhough he probably did not realize he was playing with powder. French powder indeed. Lot's of people here put their identity in what they do (and not what they are!) This leads to the PAC, the protection of farmers, fishermens, public service strikes etc...

But this will blow up in his face : being a "cheminot" is also an identity (cheminots are often children of cheminots...). So is "taxi driver", truck driver, teacher, etc... We begin to hear this "identity" justification in many areas.

I wonder what Sarko will say when 30 million stubborn french males, yelling at each other (Asterix syndrom!) will start pressuring him with messages like "my job is my identity, don't you dare touching it". Maybe then, after all, they both (Sarko & unions) we'll be able to restart thinking again...

[John Gregory Flinn]

"I have to say that living in a country (England)..."

I sympathize with you ALBERT.
Moreover there are the 'Grand Ecoles' here which some claim are as you say (in England) - "with most places in the top institutions reserved for the most expensively educated".
So the phrase you like which the French students claim - "All universities must be equal" - seems either a paradox, or indeed an aspiration with deep political significance.
Wasn't it 'Animal Farm' where that phrase achieved infamy!

[thinknoworpaylater]

All this talk of battle is beside the point. Of course I agree with Frank S. - a good organizer deals with things quietly and carefully. But the primary problem here is lack of investment in France by investors. French investors do not like taking risks, unlike American investors, but it is a necessary feature of the capitalist system. However Sarko also needs to consider positive initiatives as well as cost-cutting in the public sector. High employment taxes and a number of other restrictive practices used by small firms or employers contribute to the sluggish French economy. Starting a new business in France is excessively difficult, not merely because of bureaucracy (agreed) but also because existing entreprises are able to block new commerce using existing protectionist rules. As to Sarko's plans for the Universities they seem to resemble Thatcher and her acolytes. I worked in one for some years and the introduction of fees planned under the Conservative regime and carried through by Blair (may his name be damned) have produced enormous student debts. Scottish Universities have been relieved of this problem lately but the situation persists in England and will get worse. As to dropout rates in France; limited entry to higher education by ability exists in the UK and in most other European countries. The French solution has been a disaster. At the same time dropout rates in the UK are increasing partly because of the fee-paying system. If the French move to the UK system of fees rather than ability. Finally, if Sarko continues to cut back the public sector consumption will decrease, unemployment will rise and economic growth will decline. You need consumption as well as investment to prosper!

[ms marple]

FRANK, please understand, I think this blog is open to anyone, i don't care about anyone's nationality, skin colour, religion, job, whatever; but like Albert, I see (je constate) that the blog is mostly dominated by France - USA rivalries, and in an often unpleasant and unproductive way.
So far this thread isn't, and contains pertinent comment submitted by (presumably) posters of different nationalities, on a situation in France. Which in my view is how it should be.
It has not yet been transformed into a slanging match between two American bloggers or a downright diatribe from a lone one, on whatever is uppermost in their thoughts at the time. Very refreshing.
JOHN,I think the phrase "four legs good, two legs bad" is the one I remember best from "Animal Farm", as well as the last sentence which is something very like "and the animals looked from pig to man and from man to pig and from pig to man again, and found at last that they could no longer tell the difference". Can't see this happening here though.
To the new ANON post - yes, often almost the first question one asks of someone new that they meet is "and what do you do?" or "et qu'est-ce que vous faites dans la vie?" so there can be (on both sides of the Channel) a strong personal identity with the way one earns one's living, often whole towns and traditions revolve around it too, as with (in UK) rugby league, brass bands, crown green bowling, etc. So it's hard indeed to see your industry die because of forces outside your control under a president who's very comfortably off thank you.
So identified are we by our profession or trade that it's an inevitable reaction, but we've come a long way from he days when the question might have been: "and tell me, what does your father do?" :)

[Daniel Strohl]

Albert,

"I quite like the phrase ‘All universities must be equal’. It is a good aspiration"

And I like your post ! However, regarding the above quote, I am afraid that it is propagated mostly by mediocre students, who do not want any competition whatsoever, and who enjoy to be able to remain students as long as possible, with meanwhile as many state subsidies as possible (of course, they do not get a huge "pay"). As long as they are students, they have no major worries...

"As for encouraging more French contributors, perhaps it could be made clear that posting in French is ok."

This would most probably encourage French bloggers somewhat limited in English. But some American or British or other nationalities limited in French would then have problems -- there is no easy solution.

[azloon]

Wasn't it 'Animal Farm' where that phrase achieved infamy! JGF

"but some universities are MORE equal than others'

Mr. Flinn,

Animal Farm indeed. All animals are equal BUT some are more equal than others.

[The 3rd Column]

Albert,

What do you mean by "I quite like the phrase ‘All universities must be equal’."?

[Andy]

I believe that France is facing a moment of seminal choice. Rebirth or continuation in a mould that flies in the face of economic and social common-sense.

The fact that 12 years ago with Chirac/Juppé that same choice was spurned has had its consequences and, regrettably for France, those have been negative. I hope that this time, for the future of France, deeply needed reform ensues.

This time there is no sacrificial Juppé lamb. As others bloggers have noted, this is about Sarkozy and his Presidency. However, as I always answer to French friends who tell me "Oh how we need a Thatcher now" I say "Actually it's not in Sarkozy's hands but in those of the majority who have voted for reform".

The French have perfected the art of protesting against reform. Isn't it about time that they - the majority that elected Sarkozy on his programme for reform; the majority, that in all the opinion polls that I have seen, who support the reform of the special regimes - made a bit more noise? Get on LA RUE.

p.s. Yes, I agree. How could Sarkorzy have allowed his Presidential salary to be balooned at a time like this. Stunning.

p.p.s. I find Albert and John G-F's comments about expensive education 'buying' best university places to be almost as stupid as the students protesting against "unequal univerisities". Please protect us (I'm a Brit) from a system that promotes 'égalité' but produces 40% drop out, and huge disillusionment, in the first year of university education.

[Dominique]

Houps! i did it again!

anonymous Posted by: | 12 Nov 2007 15:36:23 was mine!

[azloon]

while these 'freeloaders" are plotting the shutdown of french life, other french are taking a higher road.

link below is to article about pierre omidyar, french- born founder of ebay, the fabulously successful u.s. online auction website. omidyar is good example of what happens when you take a superior french brain and incubate it in an encouraging environment.

happily, omidyar has learned american values concering his multi-billion dollar fortune: he and his wife will donate 99% of it to charity during their lifetimes. it's not the money that's important, its the reward of being recoginized, and of being given the opportunity to put the money to good use (other than horde it).

http://www.achievement.org/autodoc/page/omi0bio-1

so we'll watch these sorry-ass, 'underpriveledged' french workers as they seek to do less and get paid more, and know there is a better way.

i wish sarko luck. if he flames out as president of france, he can always come to the u.s. and become a venture capitalist (like al gore did this week). i am sure he'd be great at it.

[:terry]

Taking Frank's theme, all battles are won before they are ever fought. That big pay raise was a terrible political mistake.

I was interested that the students think they have "a right" to retire at 55. Is that codified into French law somewhere? Or is it some abstract right?

[azloon]

[(this string) has not yet been transformed into a slanging match between two American bloggers or a downright diatribe from a lone one, on whatever is uppermost in their thoughts at the time. Very refreshing] mzzz marple

enjoy the vacation, sweetheart.

:)

[azloon]

re french universities

do french universities have endowments, which provide scholarhips to qualified and needy students?

do successful alumni of la sorbonne donate substantial amounts of money to their alma mater in appreciation for the opportunity to get an education there?

or is it a 'droit,' as it seems everything else is in la republique?

frenchman pierre omidyar, cited above, donated $100 million (70 million euros?) to his u.s. university in gratitude for his education. that's alot of money which can be used to give deserving and needy students financial aid. and, because american private universities are expensive, this is important.

yes, many students leave university here with a substantial amount of debt. but to listen to some of the whiners on this board, this debt is totally unacceptable.

imo, it's the end result of attending a fine university which creates wealth gathering opportunities for the student so as to repay the debt. there's no free lunch, as many europeans believe. the french will finally understand this, but only after they've been hit over the head long enough, and their universities are in shambles.

what good is an free education if it's in a shit university, with shit facilities, where many, if not most, students hide out for years, and fill the street everytime some issue affecting their 'freeloading' status is threatened?

IT'S NOT WORTH VERY MUCH, imo.

my son considered attending the sorbonne after leaving the u. of madrid, but decided the place was such a "zoo" there was no point in doing it. he did, however, use the school's bulletin boards to find other musicians to play with. so i guess the place is worth something.

[Judith]

On the matter of the strikes being inflicted on the people of France over the next few weeks, how long will it be before the 60+% of French people who hope to see President Sarkozy tough it out say "Enough is enough". How much inconvenience are they expected to bear? What affect will all this strike action have on the economy? France voted for change and rupture during the election. Sarkozy made no secret of his intentions. Why isn't he given the option of implementing his election promises? Does France expect to take a leadership role in Europe and the world when every step towards reform is halted in its tracks by strike action?
However I wouldn't underestimate Pres Sarkozy. He is a consummate politician and he, as well as everyone else, knows that his credibility and his prospects for future power (and a second term) rest on his finding a way through this particular problem.

I have just caught up with the avalanche of comments on the Sarkozy US visit which were lots of fun exploring the nature of blogging. However I think there was not as great an exploration of the visit as I would have hoped.

I saw some film of the Angela Merkel/George Bush press conference at Crawford. It seems that Angela Merkel only smiles for Nicolas Sarkozy. That should help France/German relations.

[rocket]

A nice take on French life as seen through a writer for the Times nonetheless

http://tinyurl.com/2qbgs6

[Paul B]

This conversation is pointless because it's all based on a wrong precept: that the english translation of the word "université" is "university". It's not. Université is free, open to all with a bac. Their structures, sizes, numbers, have nothing in common with university in UK/US. And, thanks God for that, they're the tip of the iceberg of secondary education in france. This whole conversation is like comparing cars in the UK with passenger buses in france, just because they are spelled "cars" in both countries.

[Paul, universities exist in every country, however you want to call institutions of higher education (tertiary, not secondary). Universities are not the tip of the iceberg in French higher education, they are the majority of it. their problem is the waste and underperformance that leads to a 50 percent drop-out rate and, as Jacques Attali said today, their devotion to creating future chomeurs by letting students sign up in filières (like psychology) that do not lead to jobs for most of them. CB]

[John Styx]

To Azloon: the Sorbonne doesn't exist as such any more. Four different universities live in the historical buildings and claim some link with it. There are now 13 universities in or near Paris. It's a complete mess.

No (undergrad) student has any reason to give any money to any of these universities. The facilities are godawful. The Jussieu campus looks like a level of Doom (as in the video game). There is no esprit de corps whatsoever.

And it's certainly not in French culture to donate huge sums to their alma mater. Even Grandes Ecoles, which offer nicer facilities and sports teams, are quity lousy raising funds from their alumni. Can you believe some French people actually criticized Warren Buffet for giving loads of his own money to charities? Yuck.

[christopher muir]

Usually after a lengthy strike ends there is a widely appreciated hero who emerges from the mess. The man or woman who brings about a resolution will receive wide acclaim from a stressed population. I wonder who will be receiving applause in the coming days.

[textibule]

My French son of American father (that's me) went through the French University Shuffle, too.

This is much more involved with finding cheap apartments in distant cities, then furnishing them cheaply (Thanks a lot, IKEA), than in getting an education. In our case, it meant three apartments in 3 cities in 18 months, culminating in, who'da guessed it? my son dropping out.

Fortunately, he was able to immediately and successfully start an internet business, that to this day, in exchange for 70 hour work weeks, pays him 1 minimum wage and, through his social charges, confers the warm fuzzy feeling of subsidizing at least 3 regimes spéciaux retirement paychecks.

When he reads about Pierre Omidyar, his faces scrunches up briefly, then he smiles, talks about the lentilles aux andouilles they had for dinner last night.

What I am wondering in all this is that when the cheminots exige that any change to their regime spéciale be subject to negociation, what is there to negociate?

Nom d'une pipe!

[azloon]

]Can you believe some French people actually criticized Warren Buffet for giving loads of his own money to charities? Yuck.] John Styx

John, why am i not surprised?

[Ros]

ALBERT
" As for encouraging more French contributors, perhaps it could be made clear that posting in French is ok." Maybe, but personally I think that the French contributors write really excellent english (much much better than the English or Americans would write in French).

[The 3rd Column]

Charles,

Re Universities: The French must accept that French universities have a problem. (I'm Anglo-French.)

One way to perhaps reduce the number of students trooping to uni with their bac, and by extension, overpopulating unis leading to what you rightly say 50% dropout is to institute entrance exams.

Useless going for egalitarian dogma "opportunities for all" when at the end of the day, the quality of education in the universty falls below acceptable level because of overpopulation, undermanned staff and not enough resources.

Reason why there's been a proliferation, 'mushrooming' everywhere of the grande école or the école superieure scheme (these are actually specialized institutes of learning, that started in the early 80s) is on account of what one commenter here calls the "zoo" environment in unis that began during the Mitterand era.

In a way, entrance exams should and could help achieve what unis seek to achieve: top notch education for those who want it and go for it.

However, I have no doubt that the generally left leaning university 'syndicats' (and their cohorts in other professional labour unions) will oppose the entrance exam scheme. But this country's left leaning folks have got to come to terms with the fact that the world is evolving and must reject the Mitterandist inspired dogma of 'nivellement par le bas'.

Re: retirement at 55? Sure! Simple: Just don't expect full pension or wait till they're 65 to obtain pension. Complete idiocy this retirement at 55 scheme, absolutely mind-boggling that people think that they should be entitled to full pension and retirement privileges when the coffers of state are almost bankrupt. Either they go with the beat or suffer the consequence. No 2 ways to go about it.

The French must give President Sarkozy a chance to do something about the mess/es in France -- let him walk the talk!

[Ros]

John Gregory Flinn:
The students are saying that all "universities" should be equal - this says what it means. They are not including the Grandes Ecoles which are quite different -(I believe we had a blog about this some time ago) - these are for the highly intelligent who are able to pass the Concours and whose parents are able to afford their much longer studies than in University.

[Sandrine]

"France voted for change and rupture during the election. Sarkozy made no secret of his intentions. Why isn't he given the option of implementing his election promises?"

I'm sorry Judith, did Sarko win the election with 100% of the votes ? If not, then you can imagine that NOT everybody agreed with what Sarko proposed in order to reform France. It's not that hard to imagine/understand I guess.

Now Charles you never speak of "la Dati" with all her reforms (you know, suppressing (I dunno how many) courts all around the country. So today it's not only the "privilégiés" that demonstrate their anger, there are also the judges and the lawyers.

Hey guys, just so you know (and totally OFF TOPIC), I just came back from New York. What a town !!! It has nothing to do with Washington. I should have gone there instead of going "en province" !! :o)

[The 3rd Column]

Am not including HEC, ESSEC, and other institutes with GRANDE ECOLE vintage, etc. among those grande école or école superieure stuff that mushroomed in the early 80s.

[Frank Schnittger]

Sandrine - it doesn't really matter if you win an election with 50% or 100% of the vote. You still have a mandate to implement your election programme subject only to the constraints of the constitution.

Part of the deal with living in a democracy is that you sometimes have to accept decisions made by the majority with which you disagree. To try to overturn the decision of the majority on the streets is to act undemocratically - however it might be dressed up in Trotskyite or revolutionary rhetoric.

Whatever else you might say about Sarkozy, it's not as if he is pursuing policies the French Electorate didn't vote for. Sometimes you have to side with democracy even if you don't like what the people have decided.

It's what happens in a mature democracy. The question is, has France really grown up since 1968?

[azloon]

[just so you know (and totally OFF TOPIC), I just came back from New York] Sandrine

make a lot of bling, Sandrine, and you may be able to live there someday.

about being off-topic: blog string 'coherency nazis' (oops i can' use that word since this is readable in france and germany) may object, but I approve, and, as Valentin knows, i control the direction of this blog. :)

[qwerty]

The bloggers' feedback on this subject is particularly inspired.

However, just on the tiny issue of Sarkozy's salary increase ("ballooned" by 200%): his original salary, inherited from a Chirac decision, was 8000 € a month. That's the remuneration of a mid-level associate in a French (not even anglo-saxon!) law firm. The monarchistic Chirac, as everyone knows, had all his personal expenses covered by the State. A bit like Prince Charles never going out with a credit card, or even any cash. Sarkozy's current salary, around 20.000 € a month, is probably way below the salaries of certain TV hosts (Rouquier, Denisot), some of whom have been particularly critical of the new presidential salary, whereas their own schedules, responsibilities and risks are nowhere near those of a head of state.

[John Gregory Flinn]

There's a lot of talk, and concomitant resistance - usually, mostly from the left - that Sarko wants France to be more like America (USA), more 'globalised', more Thatcherite and that he even admires Tony Blair etc, etc.

Something may have got lost in translation because I'm sure all he means is for France's public sector to better embrace an enterprise culture.
He has certain sectors in mind as Charles has highlighted in his blog and appended postscripts.
Now, France is already very enterprising in significant state industries; I have posted before about the effective and prescient TGV and the nuclear electricity generating industry (and I'm sure there are others), which are envied the world over.
I think he wants to extend their successes, efficiency and their foresight everywhere else (in the public sector), but without losing the French social model.

There is a leftist, almost luddite mindset in the leaders of the current round of protests, but they can retire at 50 if they wish. However as THE 3RD COLUMN points out, their pension should be proportionally lower than retirement at, say 60.
I wonder if that is what M.Hollande has in mind with his call for negotiations.

[Andy]

QWERTY - you've missed the point. Of course the President's salary was way too low, but the timing of his payrise could not have been worse, and doesn't do much for his reputation as a savvy politician.

[Daniel Strohl]

Terry,

"I was interested that the students think they have "a right" to retire at 55. Is that codified into French law somewhere? Or is it some abstract right?"

Terry, this morning on Europe I, a well known radio station, two railway union bosses were interviewed together. One of them, head of an union (FGAAC or FGAC ?) which represents about 30 percent of the train drivers, has signed an agreement with the government, and will therefore NOT strike. He seems to be quite a reasonable person.

The second one belongs to the so called SUD union (I don't know what the acronym means and am not interested to know it either) - they have a reputation of being leftists , i.e "gauchistes" in French. The interviewed gentleman was really an archetype of the species, not to say a caricature ... For instance, he spoke French with a Parisian low level accent ("accent parigot"); this is mandatory for any "fashionable" leftist union boss.

After this lengthy introduction, I come to the point. The law now in force states that one may retire after 40 years of work – this is the case for everybody now, including « normal » civil servants. This is called « le régime général »

However, there are exceptions, for instance army, police, merchant navy and fishermen. Others, like SNCF (railway), EDF (utilities), métro belong also to these so-called « régimes spéciaux ».

Let us focus on the railway. Up to now, their particular « régime » provided for the « personnel du service actif » (train drivers and may be some others as well) retirment at an age of 50. The personnel du « service général » could leave at 55. Reason of this « régime spécial » : physical and psychological hardship of these professions – in 1945, most of the trains if not all had steam engines (one may still find a few of them in museums ...). Since decades, everything runs on electricity; there are also a few Diesel engines.

Sarkozy during the « campagne électorale » said that he wanted to abolish these « régimes spéciaux », (with an average working time of 37.5 years) i.e that it was normal that everybody should work 40 years. Since several weeks, there are negociations with the unions – the governement made offers in order to facilitate the transition. Most of the unions (7 out 8) said that they did not find the government's offers acceptable and called for a general strike starting today at 8 pm local time.

Some of the unions are going to strike rather reluctantly, since they know that their position is not very strong in public opinion – but they do it in order not to lose membership in favor of radical unions (CGT, SUD); this has happened in the past in similar situations.

Ok, now we are back on SUD and their above mentioned gentleman. His solution to the problem, as stated this morning in the interview : put every one (i.e « le régime général ») back to a working period of 37.5 years, instead of 40. So there would not be any difference...

The interviewer (J.P Elkabach) seemed to doubt somewhat that this would be possible. Not at all, said the SUDist : France is a rich country. It would suffice to make a different repartition of the existing wealth ...

Back to your question, Terry : if SUD and associated comrades ("tavaritchi", as LBH would say) are successful, the students you mentioned should theoretically be able to retire at 55 ... But experience shows that theory and reality are sometimes far away !

PS : may be I have made some smaller errors or undue approximations in the above explanations – I am not a specialist. It is a very complicated matter and the infos are not always coherent if one listens to one side and then to the other!

[Dominique]

Azloon,

"what good is an free education if it's in a shit university, with shit facilities, where many, if not most, students hide out for years, and fill the street everytime some issue affecting their 'freeloading' status is threatened? "

Of course! But the truth that in France, best schools are public and free of charge. Ask CB if polytechnic is shxxt education. All offered by my taxes and the republic!

[Valentin]

"I was interested that the students think they have "a right" to retire at 55. Is that codified into French law somewhere? Or is it some abstract right?"

The latter. The idea would be, we dragged our feet to work until 55, bearing all kind of stupid despotic bosses and doing idiotic jobs having nothing to do with the position, well, we now have the RIGHT, and for 30 years to come, to enjoy life freely and fully, travel, ski, get a suntan, contribute to blogs ! ;o)

Oh, some say it's not enough to work 30 years in order to enjoy 30 of retirement, because our pension contribution is not enough?
Well then we should tax the Capitalists more! Let The Rich pay! How dare they be rich!
---------------------------

This is the mindset for many in France, Terry.

[Maggie G]

"His original salary, inherited from a Chirac decision, was 8000 € a month. That's the remuneration of a mid-level associate in a French (not even anglo-saxon!) law firm....Sarkozy's current salary, around 20.000 € a month, is probably way below the salaries of certain TV hosts." (QWERTY)

Yes, I heard some guys discussing this on the radio, saying it was also way below the salaries of heads of state of neighbouring countries.

There were representatives from both left and right taking part in the discussion, and though the lefties were obviously more critical of the salary increase than the others, they didn't turn it into a shouting match.

Compared to other issues (the DNA thing for example, where people on the radio were literally screaming at each other) it seems to me that the left haven't made too much of an issue of it.

People have been saying that Sarkozy was mad to do this salary increase just before the strike. But he has said over and over that he has nothing to hide. Maybe he even did it on purpose to prove that he is up-front and honest and is not going to do things like this behind everyone's backs.

[azloon]

[Ask CB if polytechnic is shxxt education. All offered by my taxes and the republic!} Dominique

are there others?

[azloon]

[Well then we should tax the Capitalists more! Let The Rich pay! How dare they be rich!]

though you were attempting to be sarcastic, Vee, i am guessing you would favor heavy taxiation of profits from financial market instruments that don't pass your test for gambling.

if you are a friend of french capitalistm, it doesn't need any enemies. )

[Valentin]

"Maybe he even did it on purpose to prove that he is up-front and honest and is not going to do things like this behind everyone's backs"

Some even speak of deliberate provocation - as it was the case with Fouquet's or Bolloré's yacht.

[The 3rd Column]

re: "This is the mindset for many in France, Terry."

Just to remind you Valentin, that it's the same mindset in the US, in the UK and elsewhere in the west for many. Human nature.

[Lily]

"People have been saying that Sarkozy was mad to do this salary increase just before the strike. But he has said over and over that he has nothing to hide. Maybe he even did it on purpose to prove that he is up-front and honest and is not going to do things like this behind everyone's backs." (Maggie G.)

Exactly! He displays an attitude. I agree, he did this on purpose. He could have avoided the 'mistake' if he had wanted to.

[Frank Schnittger]

Poor Sarkozy! Even at €20,000 a month he is earning less than the Irish Taoiseach who earns €266,492pa. The Irish Taoiseach recently awarded himself a €38,000 pay increase just before calling for wage restraint ahead of negotiations with the Unions on pay increases for everybody else.

Obviously running a country like Ireland is much more difficult than running France but some curmudgeonly people have suggested that, given the size of the country, the Irish Prime Minister should earn rather less than his European counterparts.

Others have suggested that, since Irish GDP has increased by 150% during his tenure, Bertie Ahern is entitled to the increase in the same way as a private sector CEO would get a bonus for good performance.

It is interesting to note that Irish public sector pensions are not just inflation linked, pensioners get the same increases awarded to their working colleagues for increased productivity etc. Who says you can’t be more productive after you’ve retired?

And lets not blame all this on the Socialists. Ireland has never had a socialist led Government although they have been junior coalition partners. Trade Unionism isn’t about socialism, per se. It’s about looking after the interests of your members, and the Irish public sector unions have done a very good job in this regard.

They have done this not by going on strike, but by entering into “national partnership” talks with the Government, Employers, and representatives of Community/voluntary sector who agree a multi-annual pay rise, tax cuts, and social welfare increases based on the economic circumstances of the time.

The model is radically different from that in almost any other country in the world but has also made a major contribution to very rapid economic growth. It emerged from the torpor and recession of the 1980’s when Ireland was synonymous with rampant strikes, high unemployment, high inflation and large scale emigration.

Rather than look to the US/UK, Sarkozy might find that the Irish model, based on partnership rather than confrontation but retaining a strong statist as well as market orientation is more congenial to French tastes. But perhaps it would be beneath France to look to such a small country for inspiration.

[Lily]

”Isn't it about time that they - the majority that elected Sarkozy on his programme for reform; the majority, that in all the opinion polls that I have seen, who support the reform of the special regimes - made a bit more noise? Get on LA RUE.” (Andy)

Andy: http://www.stoplagreve.com/

[Daniel Strohl]

Frank,

"Obviously running a country like Ireland is much more difficult than running France"

LOL !

Could you please arrange for an exchange of YOUR unions against OUR CGT and OUR SUD. I think that Sarkozy and Fillon would have no problem to make sound agreements with them ...

[Dominique]

Azloon,

"are there others?"

Well, all good schools are usually public. For more than 200 years so.

Non exhaustive list below :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandes_%C3%A9coles

Please note that what we call "university" in France is "lower level education". You can't compare with US system where HAVARD or Stanford are called "universities". That would be "grandes ecoles" in France

[:terry]

Daniel:

Thanks for your thorough explanation. I now have a better grip on what the French situation is with retirement.

[Judith]

"It is a very complicated matter and the infos are not always coherent if one listens to one side and then to the other!"

Thank you Daniel for your helpful explanation. It confirms that the interests being protected in this strike are very narrow and that the wider society have every right to object and let their annoyance be overt. I recognise that history and culture may make that difficult but it seemed to me when I observed the presidential election(s)up close that a good percentage of the people of France was looking for a slightly different the future. Otherwise they would have elected Segolene Royal.

[azloon]

Dominique --

the wikipedia article was quite enligtening for me.

i can see in the french system broad parallels to the u.s. system, though the french system is peculiarly french.

we too have 'state universities' which, at least in the past, were obliged to accept all high school (secondary) graduates. that has now largely changed, but any student may attend a community college (a two-year program) and if they do well, they can go on the university. some of these two year graduates even quality for prestigious univesities like harvard or stanford (tho not many). but if they excel at a state university or a private college (of which there are thousands), they can go to harvard or stanford for graduate studies. there seem to be parallels to this arrangement in the french system.

as in britain, state universities (tax-supported) are now charging significant fees for entrants. in the past, tuition was nominal. so we have gotten away from the french system, which we used to follow to a great degree. we are more private-sector oriented now, and education costs more, even at public universities (supported by tax money). private universities receive virtually no public money.

vive la france. vive les etats unis! vive la difference.

:)

[Sandrine]

"Part of the deal with living in a democracy is that you sometimes have to accept decisions made by the majority with which you disagree. To try to overturn the decision of the majority on the streets is to act undemocratically - however it might be dressed up in Trotskyite or revolutionary rhetoric."

Frank,
I know that, but I'm also human and I don't understand why I should just accept everything and shut my mouth just because the guy was elected by others. I guess if the Left had won the election, a lot of people wouldn't be happy with it and would show their anger too. That's democracy. You don't have to accept everything and you don't risk going to jail or worse just for saying that you disagree with the government.

I don't really know why they're on strike right now, but I'm sure they have the right to do so. That's also democracy.

Hey Azloon, I'd really like to live in NY, I'll do all I can to make that happen, trust me !! I just love that town.

[qwerty]

Does the fact that the French fare so low in international IQ assessments (maths, literacy, general intelligence..) and in number of Nobel prize-winners have anything to do with the fact that their universities are so far down the list in the Shanghai academic ranking of worldwide universities? I.e. is it due to the infrastructure, or is it something - my god - GENETIC??? I don't get it. My Dutch compatriots are highly rated in these tests (see latest NYT on maths capabilities for ex.) but they didn't invent the TGV, and I find the French generally sharper (or more sophisticated).

[Daniel Strohl]

Thinknowplaylater,

"As to dropout rates in France; limited entry to higher education by ability exists in the UK and in most other European countries."

The problem is that limited entry by ability does not exist in France (with may be some exceptions). Another exception : the "Grandes Ecoles", where there is a very selective "concours d'entrée". This competitive examination has another advantage : it eliminates de facto lazy guys, since even if they were intelligent, intelligence alone would not suffice - hard work is required too.

The student unions are adamantly opposed to any entry selection - were they not, they would lose a great part of their potential "clientèle". Even leftists do not like to lose customers or, even less, to open doors to competitors ...

[azloon]

Sandrine --

i am guessing you got some attention in NYC which you liked :)

[Valentin]

"My Dutch compatriots are highly rated in these tests "

They're tests made by anglosaxons for anglosaxons, molded for an anglosaxon mind :))

[Daniel Strohl]

Judith, Terry

Re : retirement age - "régimes spéciaux"

I am pleased to know that my explanations may have helped to better understand the background(s) of the strikes.

May be one should add the following, for a better understanding : in France, the pension system is based on "répartition". This means the following : as long as people work, they pay (mostly) mandatory social charges; if they are employees – this is a big majority - their employers pay also mandatory social charges. The addition of these contributions represents a hefty percentage overhead of the real net earnings and has a (mostly) negative impact on the economy – this is the case in France since several years.

All these "charges sociales" are collected by the government. They are used to pay the « pensions » (« retraites » in French). This system worked quite well as long as the economy was running smoothly and as long as the number of retired persons did not become much greater than the number of contributing workers.

This is no more the case. The system « par répartition » has been put in force in 1945. Meanwhile, the life expectancy has increased by almost 20 years (a figure I heard on radio this morning – I am not quite sure if it is accurate) and the number of babies has decreased.

No need to be a high level mathematician to understand that the system has limits. Two remedies : increase the « charges sociales » (no need to be a great economist either to foresee the consequences) or increase the working time (in some European countries, the age of retirement is already 65 or 67 years).

Of course, if one listens to the unions, these primitive calculations are not relevant for « les régimes spéciaux » which go on retirement at 50 or 55 years... However, I have heard this morning too that the government (i.e our taxes) pay 5 billions Euros every year to compensate the deficit of the retirement scheme «des régimes spéciaux ».

Another primitive calculation would no doubt show that this figure would continue to increase in the future if one would comply with the unions.

[rocket]

Valentin

"They're tests made by anglosaxons for anglosaxons, molded for an anglosaxon mind :))"

Valid point. I often find two interpretations possible in some tests that I give but of course there is only one answer. Either ABC or D.

Having lived in France for 30 years I am able to see the French point/interpretation of view on many of these questions. The same thing applies for the Japanese. Different interpretations of questions etc.

So the question is "How do we create a culturally neutral IQ test"????

[Valentin]

Rocket,
They must each be created by each nation!

I'll reformulate your question:
Can we find a definition of intelligence common to all nations and which can be expressed mathematically?

What is intelligence?
Number crunching, memory and geometry skills only? Vision, power of abstraction too! And how about the quality of approach to a problem, which is culturally dependent! How do you put these in a test?

[Daniel Strohl]

Qwerty,

"have anything to do with the fact that their universities are so far down the list in the Shanghai academic ranking of worldwide universities"

It has mostly to do with the almost systematic levelling by the bottom occuring in our education system, and not only in the universities as described in various posts. Nobody up to now has succeeded or even tried earnestly to correct durably the situation, out of fear of the unions and of the electors (many of them « require » that their children get their baccalauréat). And when a politician, left or right, wants to get votes ...

The problem is that a baccalauréat of the fifties has nothing in common with the bacs "granted" today to 80 % of a class of age « learning » in secondary schools. And in lower levels, the discrepancy is similar. Furthermore, the famed "bac" is sufficient to enter almost any "université", without any selection. This is "democracy" (thanks to 1968, then 1981) – the fall outs are like Tchernobyl, they last ...

Regarding Nobel prices, the French had a fair share of them in the past. This is no more true, as you noticed. All French Nobel prices came exclusively from the university – the « Grandes Ecoles » have different functions and aims.

The universities now have two handicaps : lack of money (with respect to the high number of students), and disorders organized by too many « students » who do not have either the necessary level or the required motivation, and who do believe they have « rights ». This situation discourages and hinders many potentially good students – but this of course is not due to an obscur genetic malediction!

I went at school in France in the forties and first half of the fifties. I keep excellent memories of the school system of this time. We were probably not better, but not worse either than our counterparts of neighbouring countries ...

Let us hope that Sarkozy and his team will manage to bring things back in order. It will take time, but as one of your compatriots is quoted to have said : « It is not necessary to hope in order to undertake, and it is not necessary to be successful to continue » (I hope that my quote is not too approximative ...)

[azloon]

[« It is not necessary to hope in order to undertake, and it is not necessary to be successful to continue » (I hope that my quote is not too approximative ...)]

nice..

[rocket]

Valentin

"Can we find a definition of intelligence common to all nations and which can be expressed mathematically?"

You've got a mathematical mind I have more an empathetic mind (in spite of some of my posts LOL.)

Mathematics are too cold for me. You need some empathy and in the global world you cannot simply build a mathematical empirical model and use it as a measuring stick.

Mathematics doesn't sell Airbuses and Boeings. Empathy does.

ie Concord(e). Great plane. Too bad there were no customers.

The question IMHO is how do we transmit different (cultural)interpretations into coherency that transcends national boundaries and is understandable par "un fil conducteur" common to everyone. I don't know

If you have an answer, I'll invest in it. Looking at world history, this problem hasn't been solved yet.

[Valentin]

"ie Concord(e). Great plane. Too bad there were no customers."

...because it was so far ahead of its time !

[John Styx]

Daniel, quite a lot of French Nobel laureates were actually educated at the Ecole Normale Superieure or at the Ecole Polytechnique! All Fields medalists are alumni of 'Normale Sup'. A lot of the best French post-grad courses are actually the exclusive preserve of students from either of these two Grandes Ecoles. 'Simple' students have virtually no chance to be accepted.

[rocket]

Valentin

"ie Concord(e). Great plane. Too bad there were no customers."

...because it was so far ahead of its time !

Exactly Valentin. Leave it to the French to spend billions of taxpayer money on a commercial venture for a great idea that was economically unfeasible from the get go just to say

WE DID IT! cocorico!!!!!

[Valentin]

The idea was in any case more economically VIABLE than others' landing on the moon - LOTS MORE SO.

(and to think the same bunch want to land on Mars now, talk about pragmatism...)

[Daniel Strohl]

John Styx,

Thanks for the rectification. Of course, I have not invented my sentence "All French Nobel prices came exclusively from the university". As far as I am able to remember, I have read it in an article or an editorial of a weekly magazine, may be one year ago. Next time, I will be more cautious with memorized quotes and with forgotten author name ...

However, I did know that several or many Nobel laureates have been educated at Ecole Normale Supérieure. In my mind, this prestigious school belonged or belongs to the Université, since its primary aim, as I understand it or understood it is to educate high level teachers and professors. Of course, many of them make research, but some of them follow different paths. For instance, I know that the brilliant young "rédacteur en chef" of a well known weekly is an alumni of ENS ... This was also the case of Georges Pompidou and of Houphouët Boigny, if my memory is not wrong (this happens ...).

PS : I know personally at least one alumni of ENS (Cachan). This young man is the son of a former colleague, whom I held in high esteem. When she asked me shyly if I could try to organize « un stage » for her son in a German high tech company with which we had good business and technical contacts, I did my best, and it worked.

The « stage », during the summer vacation, was a success both for the « stagiaire » and for the company. The technical director of the latter called me and asked me if I did have some more « stagiaires » of the same « trempe » on stock – if yes, he could use them at once. Unfortunately, it was not the case ... The young gentleman (who is now about 12 years older ...) is or was teaching in a lycée somewhere near Strasbourg.

[Daniel Strohl]

Valentin,

"want to land on Mars now"

Pour le moment, et pour un bon moment encore sans doute, ils tirent des plans sur la comète ...

[Valentin]

Daniel:
' ils tirent des plans sur la comète ..."

qui peut le plus, peut le moins, on dirait ! LOL