French BlackBerry fear

A few years ago the Americans panicked about supposed French spying on their business secrets. Executives were advised to be silent in French hotel rooms and avoid sensitive subjects on Air France jets because the seat-backs were bugged. Now the paranoia is on the other side, with a French government ban on BlackBerries.

Le Monde reported yesterday on the unhappiness of staff in President Sarkozy's new administration over the no-BlackBerry rule, which stems from fear of US spying.

The problem arises because all of BlackBerry's push e-mail transits through servers in the United Kingdom and United States.

According to the French General Secretariat for National Defence (SGDN), this raises the possibility that the US National Security Agency (NSA) or their British partners could be tracking BlackBerry chat among government cabinets. These are the private offices of ministers which have a total of hundreds of staff.

"The risks of interception are real: c'est la guerre économique," said Alain Juillet, head of economic intelligence for the government. To convince his audience, Juillet noted that when they hold negotiations, American bankers and business people put their BlackBerry's on the table with the batteries out to show that they are playing fair; said le Monde. That is surely not a parallel, though, because the fear there is surreptitious communication not spying. 

Le Monde focused on the frustration of staffers who are new to the arcana of the state bureaucracy, many of them BlackBerry addicts from the business world and law firms.  "We feel that we are losing a ridiculous amount of time. We have to relearn the old way of working," moaned one. "We are becoming victims of a digital divide."

The government is working on a secure French alternative to the Canadian-made wonder, but so far they have been unable to produce anything as slick.

Maybe the French are behind the curve. I thought that BlackBerry mania, or at least excessive dependency on pocket push e-mail, has been diagnosed as a handicap to efficiency. As a journalist it is infuriating  when the person you are talking to has his or her thumb and eyes on their PDA e-mail.

Imagine how dreary it must be for the computers at the NSA to have to trawl through gigabytes of gossip between bored French fonctionnaires.

Comments

[textibule]

"Imagine how dreary it must be for the computers at the NSA to have to trawl through gigabytes of gossip between bored French fonctionnaires."

I have been bored by dreary conversations between French fonctionnaires on many occasions. It is part of living in France.

Weren't computers invented to do that kind of listening for us?

[Anita Rieu-Sicart]

Nothing to do with above, but a story from one of my readers that you might find entertaining/horrific, can you suggest where one can mail it, PERHAPS TO GET IT PUBLICITY, ACTION, ATTENTION FROM SARKOZY'S OFFICE? ANYTHING!
Anita Rieu-Sicart, Editor VAR VILLAGE VOICE
BEAM ME UP SCOTTY!
A Never Ending Story or how I came to loath Telecoms Companies

Last January I cancelled my long-standing phone/Internet contract with Wanadoo/France Telecom in favour of Neuf Telecom. Neuf had offered a good package at a good price and all went well until April 20 when I lost ADSL synchronisation. This has happened twice before and had been easily rectified by replacing a card in the exchange. Unlike in the past our line was now” total degroupage,” which means all phone calls go through the modem and you do not have a conventional phone line. So no Internet connection, no phone.

I made many expensive calls to Neuf using my portable with the same pantomime routine always starting with “I have no record of an earlier complaint”. After 3 weeks of inaction and rising blood pressure I went to France Telecom and asked them to restore my phone line. I also mentioned there was a problem with the ADSL and that once I had an acknowledgement from Neuf cancelling our contract I would want a high speed connection, a 2 Mb connection.

Within three or four days the phone was restored and using my old dial up modem, we could at least send and receive E mails……… The acknowledgement arrived from Neuf and I signed a contract with FT to provide a 2MB ADSL connection within a week. A week passed and no ADSL connection was forthcoming

I returned to the Agence and having waited for ages was told that the non appearance of the Service they had sold me was nothing to do with them, it was a technical problem. If it didn’t work it had to be a technical problem. Not for one minute did they think about checking to see if it was an admin cock-up. I had said there was a problem when I signed the contract but I was wasting my time. They have no procedure for dealing with input from a Client other than ignoring you. However it did not seem unreasonable to me that the Agency, my original point of contact, should sort it out. Big mistake, it quickly became clear it was for me to sort it out. I persisted and eventually my reluctant Vendeuse agreed to call somebody and the phone was passed to me. Success! They would send somebody out within two days to fix it.

That meant that he would come on a Friday. Well a Technician did come on that Friday. He phoned to say that I was right, it was the card that created the ADSL circuits that was faulty. I felt fantastic. At last somebody other than me had identified the problem. Everything was going to be all right. Guess what?. That’s right; he didn’t have a card with him. Anyway, not to worry, they would fix it by Tuesday, just watch for the ADSL signal light on the modem says he…

Tuesday came and went.

I returned to the Agence for the third time and another long wait. I explained my problem to one of the sourest women I have ever met. . She says no she can’t help me; I must ring the help line. I say no, the contract hasn’t been fulfilled and it is for her to sort it out. She says no. I say yes. She goes off to see La Responsable.. La Responsable refuses to even look at me, let alone help. Sourpuss tells me again that I must ring the help line. I say why should I when it is chargeable at 39 centimes a minute? She says because that is how it is.......I say I want to use the phone in the Agency. She says no. I say I want to see La Responsable. She goes off to ask La Responsable and comes back to say that I cannot see La Responsable nor can I use the phone. Furthermore if I persist the Agency will make the call to arrange for another Technician to come out and I will be charged for the visit…………...

By now I am feeling that the service culture in this country is going to cause me to commit murder one day and I just have to get out of there

That evening I called the number, the Orange help line 3900 and wait and wait.. I put the phone down and called the line fault freephone number 1013. After a relatively short time a very helpful person has grasped the problem, apologised for the delay and says somebody will come urgently. Somebody comes the next day and he speaks English! It is not the card he reports, it must be something in your house. His test kit quickly confirms he is wrong and that there is no ADSL signal arriving at our house. Must be the line he says and goes off to do a test. 10 mins later I suddenly get an ADSL connection but I can’t register on the network. Then I lose it again. Then the phone rings but I can’t hear the caller. Finally the Technician gets through and reports It is the card . Somebody else will come out fix it tomorrow. Tomorrow is Friday, again

By 4 pm on Friday nothing has happened and I call the freephone number again. Yes, they are on my case and a Technician will be there by 6 pm I am told 6 pm comes and goes and my problem remains unresolved. If they do come out on Monday and if they do remember to bring a replacement fully functioning card it will be a miracle.

Nothing happened on Monday so I phoned 1013. I once again put my problem but this time I was very firmly told that I had to phone Orange Technical Assistance on 3900 after which the phone was put down. Yet only the Thursday before their Technician told me that it was a card problem and that it would be put right by them, France Telecom So I phoned 3900, answered the initial questions but insisted that they listen to what had gone before, that the fault had been identified but not rectified. I was told action would be taken to get me on line within 48 hrs.

One hour later somebody from Orange Assistance called and said it was a contractual problem, not a technical problem and that I was to contact Orange Services Client Internet. So now I am being told something different again and that I must contact yet somebody else. I decided that I was going to make myself absolutely clear by writing to them in English. Late the following Friday afternoon I am informed by a recorded message that repairs will be affected within 48 hours (again)

90 hours later my wife receives a call from a France Telecom Technician who tells her the problem has been resolved. He doesn’t bother to come to the house to check, he just rings off. I return from a shopping trip to have this related to me by Yo while I watch the Modems ADSL synchronisation light furious blinking refuting his statement. Another call to 1013 to try and find out what’s going on and I am once again told to contact Orange. She said ‘it’s M Terry O’Connor isn’t it? So now I know I am in their black book......

I write again to Orange Client Services Internet suggesting that they find an Expert pronto and wondering if they need to re-think their way of dealing with Clients whom they have let down. Incidentally I have yet to receive a reply to my first letter, not even an acknowledgement let alone a telephone call. I saw our Socialist Mayor in the Post Office this morning and related my difficulties to him. Did he offer to get involved? Did he hell. No it was all the fault of Privatisation. When there was no competition France Telecom was good. It is us, us Anglo Saxons and our ideas. It will never work he says, its not the same culture. When I tell him it works in England because there is a Telecoms Regulator he decides he has to be somewhere else. Somebody told me he is planning to stand for re-election..........

It is now one month since I signed the contract

.

[christopher muir]

It will be understandably difficult for the bureaucrats to give up their BlackBerries. They'll miss their minute by minute rapid fix, but above all they will fear that their efficiency will be affected. The penseur, Jacques Ellul, observed way back in the early nineties, "Modern technology has become a total phenomenon for civilization, the defining force of a new social order in which efficiency is no longer an option but a necessity imposed on all human activity."

That intensity would be much greater today.

[Hugues]

Textibule,

Right. It doesn't make any sense to think for one split second that anyone (especially American intelligence agents who have more important matters on their plate) would want to listen to french government officials’ conversations.

This whole myth of economic competition, defence equipment exports, and dirty tricks between allies is so tedious. As if the NSA, the CIA, or similar agencies had the gall and time to build backdoors into operating systems and the likes… The French are so full of themselves!

And this silly idea of developing alternative tools when the American ones are there for the taking? Incredible!

[Michel R, Paris]

And this silly idea of developing alternative tools when the American ones are there for the taking? Incredible!

This is called the laws of Economics, Hugues. The existence of a monopoly in any field always creates the needs for a challenger.

And BlackBerry is not American, it's Canadian.

Economic intelligence is a serious matter. It is not being full of ourselves to try to protect our interests. Examples of "French technology looting" are plenty, just think Gemplus.

[Dominique]

Hugues,

You are right...we should stop making airbus and let boeing do the job, we should stop making cars and let mercedes do the job, we should stop making films and let hollywood do the job, we should stop making telecom services and let AT&T do the job, we should stop growing food and let Brazil do the job, we should stop raising kids and let the TV set do the job, we should stop reading the times and let the NYTimes do the job...

You are probably right. national intelligence is pointless because nations just love each other and do not have specific interests. We all live in Bisounours's land! Remember Irak.. it was just about love, but this stupid DeVillepin did not anderstand it.

pathetic...

stop playing with your blackberry and go back to work,you'd know what this is about...

[colin grayson`]

well lucky somebody to get such service from france telecom ; I am now able to get a very low standard ADSL on a new system called ReADSL [at an horrendous price ...no competition ]which allows connection at a slightly greater range , 7/8Km ; picked a router that they offered , 7-10 days I was told
after 3 weeks ...nothing , tried the free numbers , they won't speak to you , used the 34 cent / minute line , couldn't or wouldn't help

after 6 weeks finally got someone who said there was an order but no progress.....then a miracle ! this person was a part timer on saturday ...after speaking to me she looked into it , phoned back and said the order WAS there [ it had been acknowledged by email when I placed it ] ; problem was , the router I selected wouldn't work with ReADSL ! so they just did NOTHING ! when I pointed out that it was offered to go with the system she said she would TRY and get it changed on the website ....but little hope

so I changed the order to a nice french brand and all is installed

so I have [semi] broadband now ?
well not really , the router runs for about 30 mins the overheats and cuts off , wait a couple of hours and maybe it will work for a while

still , they have PROMISED to change it for me !!!

those with maison secondaires in the depth of the ardeche , beware

[Valentin]

Dominique's reply to Hugues perfectly resumes the situation. It is the age of worldwide competition, and any weak point can mean being pushed out of the market for some and monopoly for others. Unfortunately.

Christopher Muir:
"That intensity would be much greater today."

The intensity is becoming a bit annoying. We should probably stop trying to control everything by the minute and cool down a little.
Stop doing (and watching) polls every hour, stop following the Dow Jones, Nasdaq and CAC-40 every second, stop trying to manage businesses at minute level, or worry for every tenth of percentage lost on any of the thousands of indexes in all domains that flow in every second.

This world spins a bit too fast and loses a certain sense of perspective, solidity and maturity.
This shows at society level as well, we're not computers. You can generally speaking count on people less and less, a certain human dimension of things is getting lost, and short-term thinking is taking over everything.
We need to learn how to manage this "information age".

[Edward Johns]

The telephone nightmares related by
Anita Rieu-Sicart and by Colin Grayson prompt me to share my own insurance tale which illustrates just how unimportant the customer is to a multi- national household name company.
In the rose-tinted glow of a newly arrived immigrant to France from the UK, I signed up for motor and "top-up" health assurance with the household name company, via an agency that advertised an English language service. Everything was fine until I expressed an interest in life insurance on myself, I stated quite truthfully, that up until 10 or so years ago I had been a smoker. My agent for the multi-national company (based in Nice) actually instructed me in writing to state on the insurance form that I had never been a smoker! Naturally, I did not progress the application. When however I advised the company of what had happened, they did not respond to me at all and, not coincidentally perhaps, from that point onwards the Nice-based agency's service to me became abysmal.
When I finally got through to someone in the company and sent them copies of the evidence showing the incitement to make a false declaration, their response was that as the life insurance in question was not with themselves, they had no problem with the behaviour of their agents! Is this really the standard of integrity in the world of French commerce ? It occurs to me that consumer protection laws are also woefully inadequate as a result of this experience.

[Pierre Bernardi]

Oh my oh my! Dominique's gone right wing! And all that because of a simple spelling mistake!

[D.Strohl]

COLIN GRAYSON,

May be you could use a 30 Euro blower to cool down permanently the router. You could possibly (try to) invoice it to France Telecom.

No kidding, Colin, the blower should do the job, unless the router is really boiling. Should this be the case, then you are in real trouble, since the router will go ad padres soon ...

[Ade]

I asked my dear mum if she'd like a BlackBerry for her birthday to keep in touch better, but she said she'd far rather have some nice raspberries - preferably organic and certainly not French.

Colin, why the hell do u want ADSL in your bourgeois maison secondaire? Maisons secondaires in the Ardeche are for hot parties for heaven's sake. Get some nice wine in, maybe a few babes - preferably organic French and certainly not English (that goes for the wine too). Forget your PC/Mac/Raspberry and let it all hang out.

As for French haut fonctionnaires and their BlackBerries it's a shame they're not allowed them. This is because they suspected the yanks/canadians/anglo-saxons were planning on sending them
some booby-trapped ones that spontaneously combust, hoping that if enough of them were inanely tapping away at the same time they might take out the entire Assemblée National and do us all a bloody great favour.

[Daniel Strohl]

ANITA,

It is a true horror story ! What you describe here is absolutely not admissible. The problem is that « les fonctionnaires » work anonymously – they should have a name shield, so it would be easier to write a letter to their « patron », of course after a due (oral) warning shot. This would make them less arrogant.
However, most of the fonctionnaires are honest and helpful, but may be 10 or 20 percent of them « s'en foutent ». The same percentage exists in the private industry, but since they are afraid to be fired « pour faute grave », they are much more cautious.

My advice would be to write a short but explicit letter directly to Mr.Sarkozy, who made it plain this evening on TF1 that he means business. Of course, he will most probably not read your letter, but you will get an answer and probably things will get moving as well (I have written may be half a dozen letters to ministers in the past ten years – I have always got an answer. May be 20 years ago, I have have also written a letter to Mitterrand - I got a polite answer from his « chef de cabinet » and may be 6 months after, we had a « contrôle fiscal ». However, it was possibly a coincidence – I am not sure).

Address : Monsieur le Président de la République, Palais de l'Elysée, rue du faubourg St-Honoré 75008 Paris

Regarding your technical problem : it would possibly be a good idea to cancel your « fast » connection and order instead a second classical copper phone line. The price would be 2 x 16 Euros for the monthly « abonnements » plus may be « un forfait illimité » or possibly two (at 10 Euros ?). The advantage of the copper lines (RTC = Réseau Téléphonique Commuté) is that they always work – their principle dates back to Graham Bell (1876 !). Standard RTC modems work also without problems. This is not the case with Internet and its fast implementations, because these systems are much more complex and failures are not always easy to spot clearly and to repair. In some cases, several companies are working « together » in the system – therefore, when something goes wrong, it is usually always « la faute de l'autre ».

I have also got ADSL. Since we are close to the exchange (1800 m), we have « triple play », i.e. TV, ADSL phone and very fast Internet. When it works, it is just fine – one may use simultaneously TV, ADSL and phone. But, since I am very cautious in technical matters, we have kept also a copper line (16 Euros).
This was a good idea, since we have also troubles. For the moment being, I am able to use TV (very good quality – I speak of the transmission quality, of course) and phone i.e. the copper line and the ADSL « line ». ADSL Internet does not work – so I use my standard RTC modem on the copper line. My wife uses the ADSL set to phone to her friends. When it does not work, I am in trouble ...

My provider is FREE. I am fed up with them, but I never called their hot line up to now – I just waited things to get back running. I intented to switch to France Telecom, but now of course, I will wait and see ...

[Daniel Strohl]

DOMINIQUE,

Regarding Hugues, well done ! En plein dans le mille ! (Right on the mark)

[rocket]

I have a feeling that the Dominique of Today is not the same Dominique of a couple of weeks ago.

It seems the English is too good comparatively

Am I right?

[Maggie]

Oh Anita how I so empathise with you !
You have just written my story when setting up ADSL with Wanadoo/Orange last August.
In addition I use a Mac, which seemed totally alien to the technicians. Having insisted they come & check the line which they changed, but still could not connect they said affirmatively, it was the livebox which was faulty , shrugged their shoulders, then left !
We were 4 weeks into the debacle at this point.
Before going to FT [an hours round trip without the queuing time !] to change the box, I decided to have one last go myself .
Imagine my shock / delight when suddenly the dreaded connection light became static, the web page opened & the phone rang !
The call was from Orange saying the magic words, " your line is now activated !!! Fantastic.
All went well untill a bad storm earlier this year, wiped out our Liveboxes, I went to FT & 3 hours later came home with a new [ Windows] Livebox having said clearly it must be for a Mac, it wasn't, so lost a full week trying to connect , staff kept ignoring all my emails telling them I had the wrong codes coming from the router/ livebox.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Hugues]

To whom it may concerns (since it wasn't clear enough, unfortunately), my previous comment was, as the ancient Greeks would put it, an "antiphrasis", an ironic way of expressing something by stating the opposite. Yes, I do think that Blackberries should be switched off at government's meetings. Yes, I do think that countries should develop their own technologies instead of relying on American ones.

PS: This comment is not a funny one. It means what it says. Please don't be amused.

[colin grayson`]

well, thanks for the feed back folks ; point is the adsl comes on the copper pair anyway , and the phone always works thanks to the frequency filter , so a second line is unneccessary ;I would advise anyone to check if there is a degrouped service in their area , and go for that
but ,unless one wants to spend all day in front of the computer ,adsl is a must !
and , although I am not far away , I don't have a maison secondaire in the ardeche .....that was just a word of warning to he who guides us from cyberspace ! [ keep up the good work charles ! }

[Sandrine]

Lol, what a great thread ! Half the comments are off-topic... I could tell you my experience here with Verizon, this would also be funny. Believe me, it's not only in France that you can have this kind of problems.

[Stephen Bull]

France Telecom does seem to be a favourite target of its customers.
In Montpellier it has an open-plan retail client office in the centre of town. I regularly drop in when passing to enjoy the "theatre" as one or more customers shout and rage and jump up and down. The well-trained staff react with exemplary self control ie total indifference.

[Dominique]

still the same! thanks to the free lessons of english provided by the Times bloggers!

[Ros]

While we are on such subjects, may I advise anyone who's interested not to have anything to do with the new Noos-Numéricable - (at least TV - don't know about internet) - I have subscribed to Noos for seven years without trouble but now that they are partnered with Numéricable - your card has to be "recharged" every month but only after,( yes, I said "after" )they have taken the fee from your bank account. I have done really everything - even visited the Boutique Noos (what a joke - waiting for my turn for two whole hours!)but they still can't or won't get me back my channels which I'm paying for - unfortunately am addicted to BBC World at weekends!

[azloon]

who was that company functionaire who claimed the customer's internet problems were attribuatble to the competition now faced by france telecom -- that service was better when it was a state monopoly? what a crock de merde!!

from the sound of most posts, the problems relate to the level of service offered by the competing internet providers. my experience of france is that service is not a high priority in most french businesses, in fact, it may run contrary to the collective french personality. good service actually requires the service-giver to suspend self-absorption for a minute or two in order to listen carefully to the person needing service. and then there needs to be an apparatus within the business for implementing service requests. i may be off-base on this point, but didn't france fall behind the rest of europe in the internet area by favoring an inferior french-made system in the intital phase of internet development, and are still paying the price for this ???

for all it's shortcomings (so many), u.s. business does put a high premium on service. in fact, businesses come up short in this area frequently "go away." quasi-monopolies, such a verizon (mentioned above) have more leeway to offer inferior service, tho i don't think it compares to the service nighmare described above. i would have found an pleasant internet cafe and dropped any fantasy of accessing the internet from my home.

[Valentin]

Rocket:
"I have a feeling that the Dominique of Today is not the same Dominique of a couple of weeks ago.

It seems the English is too good comparatively"

It's not just that, he also seems younger by at least 20 years ! :)

[Valentin]

"I have subscribed to Noos for seven years without trouble but now that they are partnered with Numéricable "

The dramatic fall in Noos' QoS has actually more to do with being bought by a hedge fund. That's when all the problems began...

A friend of mine at the Defense Intelligence Agency passed on this intercepted Blackberry text message on to me. The translation was:

"Valentin:

How are you? Let's go to see Spiderman III tonight. The show starts at 8:00 p.m. Afterwards, we'll go to Keller's. See ya later.

Dominique."

[Valentin]

"How are you? Let's go to see Spiderman III tonight. The show starts at 8:00 p.m. Afterwards, we'll go to Keller's. See ya later."

Yo Terry, stop hiding, show your real name !

[Terry]

That was me who posted on the blackberry translation. Sorry my name didnt appear. You should have known anyway.

[Ellie]

@ Christopher

You are so right, the French are so full of themselves they just imagined in their heads the whole Echelon program precisely designed to spy on Western Europe by our dear trustworthy American and British friends. This is actually insane paranoia to imagine for a minute that fierce economic competition would lead to anything so un-gentlemanly as industrial or political spying. Or, for that matter, to think that there is anything worthy to spy on in that little country of ours. Silly French!

[rocket]

Dominique

Ok If you are the same Dominique

How do you spell "understand"

[Dominique back to normal socialist whiner!]

What exactly do you call a fonctionnaire?

As far as i am aware, no fonctionnaire works for any telecom service provider... All these telecom issues you are all talking about is more related to the liberalization of telecom service industry!

No more standards, no more IEEE nor ETSI for common standard definitions. In the 80s, the CNET was the voice (France Telecom R&D). Now the market. Just blame the market please! but certainly not the state!

[Daniel Strohl]

AZLOON,

"The inferior french-made system in the initial phase of Internet development" was created by the French Post Office in the seventies. Called MINITEL, it was fitted with a slow modem able to work on any standard phone line (Réseau Téléphonique Commuté/RTC). The user terminal itself was free of charge for the customers and consisted of a small display and a keyboard. The operator made handsome profits with this system, which was very popular and worked well. Of course, the operator charged fat line occupancy fees. MINITEL was discarded later, but only slowly and reluctantly, when Internet began to take over. Minitel was able to transmit mostly characters, but not moving pictures because of the low speed modem.

It is may be interesting to give a few more explanations for not technically oriented persons. At the end of the sixties (in France, but of course elsewhere as well), several companies were making trials of data transmission – for instance booking reservations at Air France or SNCF (railway), banks etc. The modems available at that time were very slow and the transmission speed was limited by line distorsions (attenuation and group delay, if there are any specialists around). So the usual practice was to select fixed lines with good
(measured) properties and to improve the chosen lines with correctors.

Internet for ordinary people came much later, with the development of affordable PC's at the beginning of the eighties and the improvement of the transmission speeds and adaptation of the transmission lines and equipments.

AZLOON, it is not quite accurate to say that « and (they) are still paying the price for this ??? », even with 3 question marks. Technically, the French Internet is not antediluvian, since we got triple play (TV + ADSL + telephony on a single copper pair) 2 or 3 years in advance of most or even all other European countries. Of course, this is limited by the distance to the exchange – 2.5 kms is a maximum for triple play. Research has been made and practical tests are ongoing with optic fibre lines which have a much broader bandwidth and a much greater distance range – but replacement of existing copper lines with fiber optic means very huge investments.

Regarding service and maintenance, we are definitely not the best ! But there are problems also elsewhere, notably in Germany. If you have a look at « Le Monde » of today or at the « spiegel on line » of yesterday, you will see that Deutsche Telekom is transferring 50.000 persons in external companies which will be in charge of maintenance and related matters. This happens after a strike which has lasted a month (!). The reason of the move of Deutsche Telekom was cost sparing and improvement of service and maintenance.

As negociated between the union (VERDI) and DT, the affected personnel will have to work 4 hours more per week, with a salary reduction of 6.5 % ! (however, there are some temporary compensations).

If I were in trouble with France Telecom right now, I would not forget to hand over a copy of Le Monde's article to the relevant « sourpuss » at FT (this word used by Anita is new for me, but I think I have got the meaning ...).

[terry]

Dominique & Valentin:

BTW: I'm sure you know but there's a dress code at Keller's.

http://www.kellers.fr/

[azloon]

DOMINIQUE;

i misspoke. the reference to a 'fonctionaire' was in a post which mentioned a mayor or civic official (not a company spokesman) who basically blamed privatization for the poster's problems.

as a 'socialist whiner,' you may be person to ask -- why have the markets failed so badly in this area (other than 'they don't work"?

are all the brilliant french techies in silicon valley (quite a few are)?

does france have a silicon valley?

it's not that there are no service issues in the u.s. there certainly are. but nothing of the scope of the complaint posted here.

the market is supposed to be capable of rewarding a company very well for offering a trouble-free service. is there a structual impediment to this happening in france? or are the people who are supposed to be helpful simply not able to pull it off??

[textibule]

French ADSL operators' lack of customer service and the resulting lack of customer satisfaction are legendary.

I wrote about this several months ago in my blog:

http://blog.cocagne.com/on-being-a-service-provider-in-the-land-of-no-service.htm

[Ros]

Daniel Strohl:
I don't know why you talk about Minitel in the past - I still use it quite frequently (and an old, free model too (!) instead of internet. Certain things are cheaper and more rapidly found - I can't give a whole list but e.g. Horav (paris airport arrivals) is much simpler and cheap too: also "Qui donc" (to find the name attached to a telephone number) is much cheaper than on internet.To use it as a free telephone directory is so much easier (& free too for 3 minutes) than fiddling around with all these new numbers (118-712 etc) or worse still fumbling thrhough the Pages Jaunes pages, though I must say that Pages Jaunes on internet is good too as it gives much extra information to each number.

[G Davies]

Michel R - why say it's not American it's Canadian. That's like saying something that's French isn't be European. Canada is in the America's so anything that is Canadian is also American.

[The 3rd column]

Charles,

Some 2 or 3 Paris air shows ago (Le Bourget Intl Air Show), the DGSE uncovered 2 US 'trade attachés' spying for US industries and were promptly expelled.

France knows that UK, which is highly dependent on the US for intelligence, forwards intel reports MI6 gathers to 'home base', i.e., US, only right that France should be wary of all these gadgets.

Btw, prohibition on the carrying of these BlackBerry gadgets have been in place in my company for quite some time now. For your info, it is also forbidden at NATO hqs in Belgium where even phones with cameras are definitely not allowed inside meeting rooms.

[Daniel Strohl]

ROS,

This is the third time I get caught for not having checked my sources or what I am writing !

The last time I saw a Minitel was may be seven years ago ...

What I appreciate in the Internet Pages Jaunes are the air-photographs of the searched-for addresses, even if they are not always centered right on the target (street number).

[azloon]

TEXTIBULE:

i have extracted a memorable quote from your blog (it helps explain some of the comments/complaints here)

"In a land where there are 400 different words for cheese but none for customer satisfaction it is not surprising that French customer service has the reputation of being the worst in this quadrant of the galaxy. And, if there is any one industry segment in France that has worse customer service than all the others, it is arguably the broadband supply sector."

what do you REALLY think? :)

STROHL: thx for recounting of french internet development. it sounds as though techology is not the problem (see above).

[Jibber]

>> As a journalist it is
>> infuriating when the person you
>> are talking to has his or her
>> thumb and eyes on their PDA e-
>> mail.

Oh the indignity of it! My heart bleeds for the journalists who can't hold the attention of their interviewees.

[Dominique]

Azloon,

Eazy : in France, public services are good, private services are bad. This is why telecom services went down since privatized eventhough we should not exagerate this. Orange (former France Telecom) still has the best service there is and i never had to complain about it. It is a bit more expensive (the law forbid them to lower their prices because they own the historical infrastructure network and have therefore the best cover of the teritory) but top quality.

But it is like that. Don't forget values are reversed in France as compared to the USA. People don't want privatization because it always means lower quality. Experience always prooved that. Once privatized, money only is the goal. Quality and safety therefore start to sink. This is why people fight to keep health services, trains and Energy in the public sector!

[azloon]

DOMINIQUE:

americans initially resisted the breakup of AT&T ("Ma Bell") back in the 80s. this was not a government entity, but highly beaurocratized, nonetheless. and inefficient. currently the communications market is a welter of companies that came out of that breakup, plus a few new ones. the results are better, imo, than if AT&T had existed alone as we entered the internet age.

monthly service bills are modest ($30 USD for unlimited calls, $30 for high-speed internet). service quality is high, and performance is reliable. when i recently complained about having a problem with my modem, a repairman was immediately dispatched to my home. by this time, the problem had gone away (i forgot to call company to tell them), so the repairman looked at my hookups, and decided a couple of connections were not good, and gave me a new splitter, all for no charge. why is this company so eager to please me? because i also get high definition cable television service from them, which with premium channels (HBO, creator of the sopranos) costs me $130/month. those are big bucks, and hugely profitable for the cable company.

we have no trains to speak of, so no comment on this area (amtrak is a government agency that does run the fews trains we do have). the privatization of airlines has resulted in a total zoo of competion, and a precipitous decline in level of service. cheap to fly, but increasingly unpleasant.

health care: the u.s still hasn't figured this one out yet. maybe the debate coming out of michael moore's "sicko," will help provide some answers. 40 million americans have no health care. that is an abomination for a wealthy country.

the u.s is very service oriented in the private sector, but, as you say, not so good in the public sector. governement bureaucrats are notoriously unhelpful. so most americans don't want government involved in important areas of their lives.

there is a joke here.

what are the three greatest lies: (1) the check is in the mail
(2) "i promise i won't ......(unmentionably crude but it involves a sex act) and (3) "we're from the government and we're here to help you."

[Valentin]

"People don't want privatization because it always means lower quality. Experience always prooved that. Once privatized, money only is the goal."

ROAAAAH old Dominique is back ! :) :)
One of our merciless capitalists here (preferably wearing stars&stripes) please explain to him how it goes with the competition and all !

[terry]

I am very upset that I didn't get a rise out of Dominique & Valentin in my last few posts insinuating that they were frequenters of Keller's. In fact, I am almost depressed.

Looks like I'm going to have to go back to the drawing board and cook up something better. Chirac bashing and espousing the virtues of capitalism is the only thing that seems to get these guys going.

Maybe they do go to Keller's. Anyone seen them there?

[rocket]

Dominique

"Eazy : in France, public services are good,"

That really depends what standard you set for determining good service. Since most French people have been exposed to poor service over the course of their lives, they take any small improvement in the quality of service as leaps and bounds in the quality of said service.

I think it is safe to say that although having somewhat improved thanks to privatization, the level of service in France can mostly be regarded as "somewhat sub par" when judged by non French.

Unfortuately Dominique your appreciation of what drives private industry is faulty and of course bordering on collectivism but Hélas, I'm sure that is what has been taught in French schools.

In any case your premise would make for a good debate.

[colin grayson`]

french telecom service is GOOD !!!
as johnny mac used to say , you cannot be serious!!
the delivery driver who arrived with my replacement livebox told me that they constantly have to change them ; there is even properly printed paperwork for the system to cope with the volume they deal with
face the fact , a french manufacturer gets the business irrespective of quality and inconvenience to the customer

having spent €40 on the help line I am told the system I have is still experimental ! so I asked for a credit for the costs I have suffered ; response , no way , jose

so what about a refund on my abonnement for the time I have had no service? no chance ....it works sometimes I was told

and the line is faulty , one week for a technical visit I was told ;what if I was a doctor I asked ? the same ......internet is just a hobby I was told , no priority

so some strong competition is what we need here ........sarko has just demanded that free and equal competition must be removed from the next EU agreement ; words fail me

[rocket]

Valentin

ROAAAAH old Dominique is back ! :) :)

I noticed that too

[rocket]

Valentin

"This world spins a bit too fast and loses a certain sense of perspective, solidity and maturity.
This shows at society level as well, we're not computers. You can generally speaking count on people less and less, a certain human dimension of things is getting lost, and short-term thinking is taking over everything.
We need to learn how to manage this "information age"

Why is it that the main argumentation coming out of France concerning the information age and network globalisation is that it is moving to fast. Those "qui ne prennent pas le train en marche seront laissés au bord du quai."

REALITY!

Isn't it about time in France to stop fearing the future and the unknown that it may bring and about time to begin becoming an active player and shaper of that future.

Stop waiting for a nod from your legislators, government, president and "prendre le taureau par les cornes soi meme". This procrastination (mental masturbation)has existed as long as I have been here and certainly before as I understand it through my reading of French history and economics. Unfortunately it appears to me that the French notion of Republicanisme as we know it today impedes the individual from realizing his/her full value.

But this is a subject which is too tabou to touch since it is French it can only be right.

Dominique

As per public entreprises offering a better service. I suggest that you go back to Psychology 101 and you will learn that an individual is more likely to be productive if there is not cradle to grave employment and certainly in the case of French public companies, most of the employees have nothing to fear as per losing their jobs or "une remise en cause" and spend most of their time just throwing the ball around avoiding responsiblity.

It smack of the old soviet system where no one was responsible.

Those who reject these changes can always seek refuge in the peaceful French countryside.

Sorry you can't move to China because even they work harder than in France. But I hear Siberia is nice at this time of year.

[Dominique]

Rocket,

It all depend of what you call "being responsible".

Your version : get rich or dy trying! learn from your mistakes and things will go on that way. Poors are free!

My version : once you're sure you'll have enough to eat, then you can start thinking and being responsible. That's called real freedom!

And you are right : we teach our children at school about being a responsible citizen and about the good side of being a group! together, we achieve more than by our selfs. Others are needed, not blamed nor feared!

Of course, you can say that i fear the future. Well, if change means poverty, climate change, chineese slavery, child labor and the jungle (law of the muscle instead of low of the brain), then, i agree, you can say i fear the future you want to implement. But, be sure i will fight your dangerous ideas.

Note : Peter Mandelson, the european commissaire, said once that the welfare state was some how the highest degree of civilization, but that unfortunatly, people were no longer civilized and too selfish to be willing to implement it.

I certainly will not go that far, but i will certainly never renounce to civilization!